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Split Routines?

I got flames for saying this last time . . .
Despite bodybuilders being strong, often their strength has zero real world application in a sporting sense and they've often trained themselves to be slow through the use of different training techniques
PowerSports is 100% right - you get what you train for
 
The Hamburgler said:
I got flames for saying this last time . . .
Despite bodybuilders being strong, often their strength has zero real world application in a sporting sense and they've often trained themselves to be slow through the use of different training techniques
PowerSports is 100% right - you get what you train for
Click to expand...

Thats right mate - maybe not trained themself to be slow as such - but they train to put on as much muscle as possible while trying to stay pleasing to the eye ....to most of them they dont give a shit if they can pause bench 300kg or 100kg if they are building the size they want thats all that counts.

I think some ppl on this forum have a real lack of understanding what bodybuilding/or building muscle is about and have a one track mind when it comes to training - that being the drink 10L of milk and squat 3 times a week and just deadlift and bench and your sweet....in bodybuilding it doesnt work like that.

Yes for a beginner a nice basic program is great but if they want to advance their muscle building potential not just strength potential then training has to change to to suit this and in the long run a full body split 3 times a week will not bring he gains and rewards that person wants.

Bodybuilding is a different game to strength training and yes the 2 can be very much alike in regards to lifting weights/going to the gym etc but the training templates and approach to training is worlds apart...if you ever want to be good at either one.
 
I dont really know why you think splits dont work on begineers. I mean if your doing all the big compounds and getting rest, eating right i think you will get results.
I have been doing a split since i started 8 months ago and i have seen good results for a begineer.
max dl 160kg squat 150 bench 100 (keep in mind i train for bb not powerlifting)
I know it not impressive to some of the numbers guys pull around here but i feel after 8 months my body is looking good and i cant wait til i cut.
cheers
 
Aiden3121 said:
I dont really know why you think splits dont work on begineers. I mean if your doing all the big compounds and getting rest, eating right i think you will get results.
I have been doing a split since i started 8 months ago and i have seen good results for a begineer.
max dl 160kg squat 150 bench 100 (keep in mind i train for bb not powerlifting)
I know it not impressive to some of the numbers guys pull around here but i feel after 8 months my body is looking good and i cant wait til i cut.
cheers
Click to expand...

Not sure if you were referring to my post or not, if so - I think splits are great for beginners but not needed as much as down the line - but totally agree I would be getting a beginner on a split or a full body program - just depends on the person.

I started out by doing Max-ot training which is a split plan and looking back the few yrs I was doing it were prob my best gains! - I have been planning on going back to this style of training for awhile now!
 
J3TR33 said:
I'd say this t-nation article covers it well.

T NATION | Roundtable: Training Split - Part 1
Click to expand...

However, I still stand by my point that not everybody can grow all muscles optimally from using only compound movements because the body will look for the easiest biomechanical solution to a motor problem. If you're doing a bench press, your body doesn't care if you're trying to build a large chest; it only knows that it's holding a weight that's about to give it a deep cardiac massage! So in the interest of survival, the body will look for the muscle recruitment pattern that will bring the best chance of survival.

If someone is "shoulder dominant," the shoulders will take on a greater workload, and as a result it'll diminish the stimulation placed on the pectorals. If we were to stick only to the bench press, over time the problem would get worse because the shoulders (which receive more growth stimulus) would become increasingly dominant. As a result, it'll become more and more difficult to fully stimulate the chest.
 
The picture I have of a split routine is gym rats doing every isolation exercise known to mankind for their chest, bicep, tricep and shoulders. Hardly any squats, deadlifts, presses, chins or dips. I guess training at a commercial gym is part of it.

I haven't trained using body part splits, but if I do, im always going to include compound exercises and then maybe some other exercises for more volume work.

All the rep ranges have benefits, doesn't matter if you're a powerlifter or bodybuilder.
At the end of the day what is important, is the training + diet + effort + consistency.
 
food for thought

bodybuilder, that trains like one, 1-10 sets , 1-30 reps , always changing everything almost..

[youtube]cyiXu9edsAY[/youtube]

even if he only did it once benching 180 in my book is still fucking impressive.

[youtube]TcDpN8XWH1M[/youtube]
 
Like i said noobs, even if he only repped it once, still fucking strong for 98-100kgs
 
Split routines look bad because all the gym bros just do isolation exercises as J3TR33 explained.
 
J3TR33 said:
The picture I have of a split routine is gym rats doing every isolation exercise known to mankind for their chest, bicep, tricep and shoulders. Hardly any squats, deadlifts, presses, chins or dips. I guess training at a commercial gym is part of it.

I haven't trained using body part splits, but if I do, im always going to include compound exercises and then maybe some other exercises for more volume work.

All the rep ranges have benefits, doesn't matter if you're a powerlifter or bodybuilder.
At the end of the day what is important, is the training + diet + effort + consistency.
Click to expand...

You will find most good bodybuilders will still include squats/deadlifts/presses/chins/dips in their split programs...

Its not that gym rats do split programs thats the problem its they dont have any training knowledge to know any better not to do just isolation movements/nor would they know how to even perform the movements above.

Split programs work simple as that its just how you go about them that is key - its just like someone doing a strength program and not following the basic outline of the program...

People need to let go of the connection between split programs and gym rats...most gym rats will go in see a machine that says chest and do it...they will not be googling 5 x 5 bill starr program/starting strength or even how to split my bodyparts up for best gains and which exercises...etc etc...


Like you said though training + diet + effort + consistency is key - and of course proper exercise selection and proper setting up of a split plan.
 
My 4 day split is working better than anything else. But its simple though, stick with it or it won't work.

Day 1 Chest and Back
Day 2 Quads, Abs and Lower back
Day 3 Shoulders and Arms
Day 4 Hamstrings and Calves

I do this 5 days a week. 3 exercises for chest, back, quads, shoulders. 2 exercises for abs, biceps, triceps, hams and calves. 1 for lower back.

I do a set of 30, 20, 10 then two of 6. 5 to 6 days a week. Easily the best workout I have been given and advised to do it by a natural bodybuilder who has trained up a guy recently who came 4th in NSW. He is one of the current BB natural champions. Top bloke and really understands everything.
 
Mickdog said:
My 4 day split is working better than anything else. But its simple though, stick with it or it won't work.

Day 1 Chest and Back
Day 2 Quads, Abs and Lower back
Day 3 Shoulders and Arms
Day 4 Hamstrings and Calves

I do this 5 days a week. 3 exercises for chest, back, quads, shoulders. 2 exercises for abs, biceps, triceps, hams and calves. 1 for lower back.

I do a set of 30, 20, 10 then two of 6. 5 to 6 days a week. Easily the best workout I have been given and advised to do it by a natural bodybuilder who has trained up a guy recently who came 4th in NSW. He is one of the current BB natural champions. Top bloke and really understands everything.
Click to expand...


For your body weight and lifts i honestly think what you are doing isnt the best for you...

Regardless of who you are training with they are not YOU.

I knew someone who benched 150 for reps and couldnt squat or dead. Did i listen to their training advice? No...

There are alot of other variables... And your current lifts tell me that you need to be focusing elsewhere for proper progres..
 
Christian said:
For your body weight and lifts i honestly think what you are doing isnt the best for you...

Regardless of who you are training with they are not YOU.

I knew someone who benched 150 for reps and couldnt squat or dead. Did i listen to their training advice? No...

There are alot of other variables... And your current lifts tell me that you need to be focusing elsewhere for proper progres..
Click to expand...

Haven't updated my lifts but I find it has little relevance. But thanks for the advice, i'll stick with what i'm doing and let you know how it go's.
 
Sorry what has little relivence?

I just find hamstring and calve day for a novice a little trivial.
 
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