Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_force_continuum
something you should acquaint yourself with mr arm chair expert.
something you should acquaint yourself with mr arm chair expert.
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The killing of America
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
was curious what you had said, so clicked to show the post.
not getting into it with you. but ive never worked in bondi or slapped around drunk teenagers. i worked 10 years in some of Scotland's biggest clubs and head doorman in many other. been in that exact situation 100s of times, and i have also done years of training in close quarter combative's, so no i am not an arm chair expert on this one.
the cops had several options before going lethal, which they chose not to do. while using lethal force there was extremely borderline, the issue is mainly the fact that this is what they instantly jump, ignoring 4 and 5 on the force continuum.
first option, which would of been my move, is if you were the cop closer to the head, you simply drop your knee right on there jaw/throat with force. the initial hit will stun them and by the time the stun has worn off they will likely be unconscious from using your knee to cut off blood flow on the carotid artery, (takes a few seconds to put someone out). i have personaly done this many times.
second, which i have never had the pleasure of doing. is to pistol whip the ****. handguns are a big chunk of metal and one strike could easily render someone unconscious. the other option with this is to use it as a negotiation technique, use the butt of the gun to remove some teeth and break the nose, then ask if they want to continue, if so..do some more damage. again this is highly effective and used it multiple times, people will always yield when using the force continuum.
now for the cop struggling with his other hand..well fuck me its really not that hard to restrain an arm..anyone who has had an ounce of training can do it..these cops clearly had no skills, so why are they cops. had several wrist lock options, arm bars and my personal favorite is using a limb destruction. if he was concerned about arm and potential weapon he could of used his gun/fist/elbow/knee to strike into the bicep and crush the brachial nerve, which renders there arm completely useless..be a good houw before that **** can use his hand again. again the cop on top of him could of done this with ease using his gun, or gone for the brachial plexus or perhaps just a nice strike into the solar plexus, or perhaps shatter his collarbone. so many different strikes could be sued to subdue him.
then you get into the realm of tazer/spray etc which admittedly would be hard to do if you didn't already have it in your head.
lastly could put a round in his shoulder and again continue the negotiation.
lastly shoot to kill
see how these examples follow the force continuum? they jumped right to 6 without even exploring 4 or 5.
bazza this was for other peoples benefit so dont bother quoting me your back on ignore.
not getting into it with you. but ive never worked in bondi or slapped around drunk teenagers. i worked 10 years in some of Scotland's biggest clubs and head doorman in many other. been in that exact situation 100s of times, and i have also done years of training in close quarter combative's, so no i am not an arm chair expert on this one.
the cops had several options before going lethal, which they chose not to do. while using lethal force there was extremely borderline, the issue is mainly the fact that this is what they instantly jump, ignoring 4 and 5 on the force continuum.
first option, which would of been my move, is if you were the cop closer to the head, you simply drop your knee right on there jaw/throat with force. the initial hit will stun them and by the time the stun has worn off they will likely be unconscious from using your knee to cut off blood flow on the carotid artery, (takes a few seconds to put someone out). i have personaly done this many times.
second, which i have never had the pleasure of doing. is to pistol whip the ****. handguns are a big chunk of metal and one strike could easily render someone unconscious. the other option with this is to use it as a negotiation technique, use the butt of the gun to remove some teeth and break the nose, then ask if they want to continue, if so..do some more damage. again this is highly effective and used it multiple times, people will always yield when using the force continuum.
now for the cop struggling with his other hand..well fuck me its really not that hard to restrain an arm..anyone who has had an ounce of training can do it..these cops clearly had no skills, so why are they cops. had several wrist lock options, arm bars and my personal favorite is using a limb destruction. if he was concerned about arm and potential weapon he could of used his gun/fist/elbow/knee to strike into the bicep and crush the brachial nerve, which renders there arm completely useless..be a good houw before that **** can use his hand again. again the cop on top of him could of done this with ease using his gun, or gone for the brachial plexus or perhaps just a nice strike into the solar plexus, or perhaps shatter his collarbone. so many different strikes could be sued to subdue him.
then you get into the realm of tazer/spray etc which admittedly would be hard to do if you didn't already have it in your head.
lastly could put a round in his shoulder and again continue the negotiation.
lastly shoot to kill
see how these examples follow the force continuum? they jumped right to 6 without even exploring 4 or 5.
bazza this was for other peoples benefit so dont bother quoting me your back on ignore.
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
oh and before anyone says there are no guns in scotland so its not the same..well no there are no guns, but there are a fuck load of knives which are far more dangerous in this situation.
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
nah i haven't and yes i agree would be a tough job for sure, specially the fact they ride solo. im merely talking about the exact situation which i have been in sooo many times. and cop or not, i would say i have more experience retraining people than 90% of cops out there, for the simple reason that it is a fuck load easier when you have hand cuffs!
always wondered why they dont use speed cuffs in the US much (the solid bar ones) as if he had stuck one hand in the cuffs you can then use the other end to ratchet their hand about.
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Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
mate.. cops here are a bunch of clowns. anything happens they pile in like fucking lemmings. when i got lifted over my ex 5 of them came to arrest me. had no intention of going anything but quietly!
Darkoz
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I wish they'd stop wearing shorts and riding bicycles, it does nothing for their authority
bozodos
Member
This is what I was getting at. Very tough gig. Possible that some police departments do not have rigorous enough training, there is a lot of them after all. Perhaps there should be more Afro American police as well (not an endorsement of quotas incidentally).
@Darkoz; Yes CCW is legal in Louisiana, Sterling was carrying illegally though. Guidelines are fairly clear for CCW holders how to interact with police in regards to clearly informing them that they have a firearm, and surrendering it voluntarily.
The problem with cops taking a too soft approach, especially to hardened crooks, is that they do not fear or respect them, and it makes things worse.
Good video about people jumping to conclusions and BS narratives
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Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
bozo still waiting to here about your personal experience in these matters? i presume the faxt you keep ignoring the question is that you have none?
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
and as for cops not having proper training, i thought this was textbook justified use of force? implying they arnt trained properly would be putting your argument in line with what i am saying lol
Kyle Aaron
Active member
The USA has 16,000 different law enforcement agencies. 16,000.
When I went to Rippetoe's gym in Wichita Falls, one day walking past the university there'd been a bomb scare, place was sealed off. I saw vehicles from,
1. Wichita Falls City Police
2. Wichita Falls County Sheriff's Department
3. Texas State Police
and was later told the FBI and BATF had been contacted too.
5 different police agencies for one bomb hoax in a town of 80,000 people. Seriously, how many cops could the city have? So how many new ones being trained each year? How good a police academy are you going to have for like 10 new cops a year? How much money is one dying town going to have to train these guys?
The USA is just a mess. A big confused mess.
When I went to Rippetoe's gym in Wichita Falls, one day walking past the university there'd been a bomb scare, place was sealed off. I saw vehicles from,
1. Wichita Falls City Police
2. Wichita Falls County Sheriff's Department
3. Texas State Police
and was later told the FBI and BATF had been contacted too.
5 different police agencies for one bomb hoax in a town of 80,000 people. Seriously, how many cops could the city have? So how many new ones being trained each year? How good a police academy are you going to have for like 10 new cops a year? How much money is one dying town going to have to train these guys?
The USA is just a mess. A big confused mess.
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
yes im sure they had the hind sight to know it was a hoax at the time...
Kyle Aaron
Active member
It's not that it was a hoax or not. Five different police agencies, mate. Five.
Point is, you can't get training excellence with 16,000 different agencies nationally. Most of them are going to be shit. And thus not know the things that even a good bouncer like you were knows.
Point is, you can't get training excellence with 16,000 different agencies nationally. Most of them are going to be shit. And thus not know the things that even a good bouncer like you were knows.
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
yeh i agree. thats the thing with the video you have to ask, did they just rinse the guy because he is a black ****, or do they just not have the ability to handle it in another way? i suspect it is the latter.
bozodos
Member
I'm ignoring your bait. A bouncer is not even a security guard. They're just a bloke in a white shirt who stands on a door. Like usual the conversation is above your capabilities so you desperately attempt to make yourself relevant with meaningless anecdotes. Go away.
Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
bahaha ok mate.
you have never restrained a single person in your life, you are the definition of an arm chair expert.
and if you think a real bouncer is just a bloke in a white shirt standing on a door you continue to show how little you know about this.
and im interested as to how this conversation is beyond my capabilities? considering i have done exactly what happened in the video countless times...
reality is you got called out and you aint got shit, not a single shred of personal experience to back up your views. just yet another wanabe tough guy who probably scared of his own shadow (hence your need for guns)
you have never restrained a single person in your life, you are the definition of an arm chair expert.
and if you think a real bouncer is just a bloke in a white shirt standing on a door you continue to show how little you know about this.
and im interested as to how this conversation is beyond my capabilities? considering i have done exactly what happened in the video countless times...
reality is you got called out and you aint got shit, not a single shred of personal experience to back up your views. just yet another wanabe tough guy who probably scared of his own shadow (hence your need for guns)
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Johnnie Walker
Borderline Kunce
oh and if you think my post about what could and should of done is ""attempt to make yourself relevant with meaningless anecdotes"" again shows you have no clue haha. anyone who has a shred of training in these matters would agree with me