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Deadlift frequency and volume

wingman said:
Is it possibe horse and cart are the wrong way around here and that excellent deadlifters are likely to become SM?
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Strongman activities and more importantly: Stone lifting, odd object lifting, pressing over head - commands a certain amount of skill and requires constant drills and a strong back and a big set of heart and lungs.

The deadlift is a super exercise to enable a strongman to help strengthen those areas.

It is the hip where power is generated.
 
0ni said:
Lmao ok
I guess a highly conditioned midsection is not important for a big pull and looking at what 430kg deadlifters sre doing doesnt count because they take steroids. Meanwhile in powerlifting everyone recommends plenty of heavy ab and lower back accessory. Sticky and everyone in his gym does loads of udl and planks as a base until they pull 200kg. How is that any different again? A conditioned midsection is the number one thing that gives you a big pull, no one can logically refute this. NO ONE. Being a sub 200 deadlifter is MORae reason to build a base of udl planks good mornings pulldowns and whatever else
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Yet you only do the main 3 and mininal assistance?
 
I do lots of planks udl and pulldowns
As per usual people are sparking off on side arguments instead of addressing the actual point. Can anyone give an actual argument against strongman for bringing up the deadlift? What is so bad about farmers walks, yoke walks, stone lifting and lots of repping? Seems to me getting good at these things can only help the deadlift
 
0ni said:
I do lots of planks udl and pulldowns
As per usual people are sparking off on side arguments instead of addressing the actual point. Can anyone give an actual argument against strongman for bringing up the deadlift? What is so bad about farmers walks, yoke walks, stone lifting and lots of repping? Seems to me getting good at these things can only help the deadlift
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Read my comments
 
Sticky im not placing bets but id love to see a list of powerlifters that currently compete with 400+ deadlifts. I googled for a current list but surprise i just found stronmen lol
 
Goosey said:
Read my comments
Click to expand...

If strongmen deadlift to increase their event (as they obviously do) then why do powerlifters who deadlift to deadlift not put up as big numbers? The only variable is the events training
 
wingman said:
Is it possibe horse and cart are the wrong way around here and that excellent deadlifters are likely to become SM?
Click to expand...

Agreed.
Guys like Benedikt Magnússon and Žydrūnas Savickas were powerlifters (IPF) who became strongman- both play around with powerlifting. Mikhail Koklyaev is obviously weightlifter/powerlifter then strongman.
If you are an awesome deadlifter you have attributes that cross over. Its not like strongman made them great deadlifters.
Oni- you referred to the Arnold deadlift comp. Do you mean the pro-deadlift? Last year it was won by Ian Bell- son of Gene Bell. Here is this years roster:
GNC ProPerformance Pro Deadlift Roster – USA Powerlifting at the Arnold Sports Festival

Alot of the deadlift events in strongman are with straps and from blocks.
2012 WSM had car deadlift and deadlift for reps (with straps etc?)- not really equivalent to PL deadlifts.
 
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Im on phone atm so cant look up the training of the individuals. Brad gillingham is on there though and attributes strongman to his deadlift. I think the fact that strongman has more 880lb deadlifters is one hell of a coincidence. Btw i was looking at their deadlift with a normal bar not done in a strongman comp. powerlifting and strongman training certainly go hand in hand and benefit each other. Look at the raw totals of these guys and see how many spf guys total that. Lalas savikas and poundstone have 1000kg raw totals
 
Gillingham does front squats, cleans, barbell rows, raw squats, rack pulls, RDLs etc. I know he plays with strongman stuff but I have never heard him say he atrributes his deadlift to strongman. He is a friend and has given me advice on bringing my deadlift up- I'll ask him why he has not told me this.

Some awesome deadlifters do strongman. True.
Strongman training will improve your conditioning and strength generally. True.
Will doing strongman make you a better deadlifter than just doing PL training? Why would it?
Would high intensity strongman training work better than high intensity PL training for PLers? Why would it?
 
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I found out anout gillinghams strongman stuff from the orlando powerlifting seminar. Jeremy hartman brought it up when he was talking about how strongman brought his own dl up

If you can ask him in person then that settles it but i can only comment on whay ive seen
 
The strongman events are good because they condition the entire midsection. There was discussion on tuchscherers facebook on this if you want to look it up. Midsection work is the key to a big deadlift and this is universally agreed. Strongman is just one way to do it and they typically do lots of it. Like you said gillingham does this with rdl fronts and rows. Achieves exactly the same thing. He did compete in strongman two years running
 
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The thing is if you ask Mike Tuchsherer or Brad Gillingham if strongman will make your midsection stronger- they'll say sure. But if you ask them how to train, as a powerlifter, for deadlifts, I'm pretty sure they'll say deadlifts, pause deadlifts, RDLs, rack pulls, squatting etc.
Strongman covers a diverse array for events- some of which call on strength-endurance, carrying etc and a range of different movements and skills. All of those things will help develop athletic attributes that carryover to PL, but the best thing you can do for powerlifts will be built around powerlifts. What do strongmen do specifically to improve their deadlift? The same stuff Gillingham does- but obviously they do more to cover the diverse events they do. Obviously I'm saying there is some value with the notion of specificty in training. Its not just about building muscle groups.
As far as I can tell the Russians are leading the way when it comes to the science of powerlifting and optimal strength devlopment for PL. They are not sending Sorokin, Fedosienko and Barkhatov out to flip a tyre or lift an atlas stone. When Brad or Mike are preparing for a PL comp or a DL comp they are not carrying an anvil or deadlifting cars.

Here is Brad's deadlifting outline from his blog:
HMB Blogs

He does talk about using strongman stuff, but kind like assistance. Did you see my interview with Brad on my Iron Edge blog? There he said he adds in strongman stuff only to keep the training interesting.
Digging holes will strengthen your mid-section. A strong midsection is a key to a big deadlift- it doesn't follow that digging holes is a good way to improve your deadlift.
I'm not saying strongman training is not beneficial to the powerlifts- but not accepting the suggestion that strongman training is better than powerlifting training approaches for deadlift.

Back to the original question- I think plenty of good deadlifters pull a number of times per week. I know Mike T pulls heacy twice per week- although it tends to be one comp pull and one deadlift variation, like RDLs, pause deadlift or deadlift with chain.
 
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I cant logically dispute that deadlifts are the best way to increase your deadlift. I just think that a strong midsection is important as a base. Soro fed and bark are Russian so will undoubtedly do good mornings after most sessions if their training looks anything like most of the examples of russian programming. I will post on the rts forums asking if a strongman events day is a good way to train for the deadlift as i have already made my points. Specificity is undoubtedly king but i still believe you need a massive base to pull big and strongman seems a great way to do that and is justified by lots of big pulls in the sport. I posted a clint darden video in the sumo thread about the russians just being dtrong all over. I think the russians do strongman type stuff at school as well as gymnastics or at least do as many different sports as possible to build that base. I will look that up later its in "the development of the russian conjugate system" by tom myslinski if anyone can look that up

Apologies to err one for getting so revved up about he issue but it always rustles the jimmies when people bring up drugs
 
Russians have had a few years head start using their secret training method.
And that started well before the 60's
 
A strong midsection is important, a strong body is important, but power comes mostly from the muscleture attaching the hip.
 
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