Assistance programming

[NightFallTech]

So when I say that his lats are fine and he should focus on his triceps, it's not his "weakness" as triceps strength has nothing to do with it. However hypertrophy of the muscle will increase the strength ceiling and allow your bench press strength to increase

So bigger triceps help but stronger ones don't?

 

[Christian]

Ok I think I understand how to put what I am thinking down onto paper now...

For example your bench is lagging... You need to do triceps work. It's not that you need stronger triceps, strengthening your triceps will not improve your bench. Strengthening your bench improves your bench. If strengthening your triceps worked then you could just do singles with 10% of your bench each day to keep the groove and pushdown your way to an epic bench. What your assistance needs to do is hypertrophy the muscles involved to raise your strength ceiling so that your BENCH PRESS strength increases (not triceps strength).

The close grip work doesn't make your TRICEPS stronger so much as making your BENCH stronger. It increases the range of motion and changes the leverage of the exercise. Perhaps someone who is better at explaining things can have a go lol.

So when I say that his lats are fine and he should focus on his triceps, it's not his "weakness" as triceps strength has nothing to do with it. However hypertrophy of the muscle will increase the strength ceiling and allow your bench press strength to increase

I hope I explained this well. inb4 someone misses the boat entirely

"If you can 3-board press 10 more pounds than you can bench press, then you don’t have a “lock out” problem. You just missed a certain weight because you weren’t strong enough to generate the power needed to move that particular weight through the transition point in the movement."

If you can only manage an extra 10lbs on a 3board holy herp derp

Boat missed. I have no idea whats going on.

 

[0ni]

So bigger triceps help but stronger ones don't?

Bigger triceps will allow you to build a stronger bench press
You can double your triceps extension weight but your bench would not increase by anything significant

I guess the more I think about it is you need assistance to train the movement and not the muscle... while training the muscle to make it bigger (not stronger) to increase your strength ceiling

 

[Darkoz]

^ I'm confused and my head hurts

 

[0ni]

Train the movement not the muscle as your main assistance
Then do isolations to push up muscle mass

That seems pretty simple now

 

[jzpowahz]

Train the movement not the muscle as your main assistance
Then do isolations to push up muscle mass

That seems pretty simple now

That bit makes sense to me

 

[solarbear]

I do a lot of Boring But Big, 5x10 @50-60%. My main lift usually taxes me out so much that medium intensity is about it for the accessory work.

One thing I really like to do is row every workout. The back seems to like being worked often.

 

[The Hamburgler]

Westside they row/train back just about every day

 

[vonfram88]

the only thing I do for bench assistance is weighted dips. The back work for the lats such as rows also helps. The first part of the lift off the chest needs strong lat involvement.

I don't do regular squats much and rely on box squats to below parallel plus GHR. Deadlifts benefit from both of those exercises.

 

[Danimal]

the only thing I do for bench assistance is weighted dips. The back work for the lats such as rows also helps. The first part of the lift off the chest needs strong lat involvement.

I don't do regular squats much and rely on box squats to below parallel plus GHR. Deadlifts benefit from both of those exercises.

Is that you Terry?

 

[PTCPerth]

Has to be.

 

[jj80]

the only thing I do for bench assistance is weighted dips. The back work for the lats such as rows also helps. The first part of the lift off the chest needs strong lat involvement.

I don't do regular squats much and rely on box squats to below parallel plus GHR. Deadlifts benefit from both of those exercises.

How do the lats help? I thought they opposed pushing motions

 

[0ni]

Yeah I'm going to be the one that says it
I think lat work for the bench is stupid. It's for geared benchers who need to actually pull the bar down to the chest to touch it. Upper back work however is great as it will increase tightness. So he is spot on with the rows. Same with chin-ups as the scapulae depress when you set-up on bench. I think people confuse this with "the lats". Sticky also talked about how the lats help keep the bar in the right path when benching when I talked to him at PTC. I can see this but I'm not so sure that they need to be real strong to do this

 

[Christian]

How do the lats help? I thought they opposed pushing motions

Because muscles just switch off...

They stabilize.

 

[KungFooGoo]

Yeah I'm going to be the one that says it
I think lat work for the bench is stupid. It's for geared benchers who need to actually pull the bar down to the chest to touch it. Upper back work however is great as it will increase tightness. So he is spot on with the rows. Same with chin-ups as the scapulae depress when you set-up on bench. I think people confuse this with "the lats". Sticky also talked about how the lats help keep the bar in the right path when benching when I talked to him at PTC. I can see this but I'm not so sure that they need to be real strong to do this

Doesnt it have something to do with having a wide/and or thick back/lats so you're real stable on the bench. Could be wrong and if i am i dont really give a shit, thought i read it somewhere though.

 

[0ni]

Doesnt it have something to do with having a wide/and or thick back/lats so you're real stable on the bench. Could be wrong and if i am i dont really give a shit, thought i read it somewhere though.

Yeah the heavier you are, the more your load is distributed. Which is the main reason why gaining weight helps the bench so much I would guess. Along with increased ATP etc...

 

[wingman]

Yeah the heavier you are, the more your load is distributed. Which is the main reason why gaining weight helps the bench so much I would guess. Along with increased ATP etc...

Weight gain == atp gain??

 

[0ni]

Weight gain == atp gain??

not quite
eating more calories = atp gain

 

[trofius]

Your lats are the first muscles to fire when doing raw bench, esp on skinny fkers who's elbows come down to back level.

Your lats are responsible for getting you elbows driving forward, and getting the bar moving those first 2 inches, if you time it with your leg drive magic happens.

Your lats on a wider grip can also help rotate your elbows in helping with the mid portion of the lift.

 

[jj80]

I just got 5-3-1 and it backs up something Oni said a while ago - don't bother with chains and bands on bench unless you're using powerlifting gear. The strength curve for benching with gear is easy at the bottom, hard at the top, and the reverse for raw benching. Improving the top portion of your lift doesn't help raw lifters very much at all.

I believe now that assistance works really well when you're hitting something that didn't get enough work during the main movement. e.g.:

Bench - most people weak at the bottom. Pecs/shoulders fail first. Triceps not trained to exhaustion. Therefore train triceps afterwarrds to hit them adequately.

Chins - I fail at the top / 1/2 way when my biceps come into play. Biceps fail before much stronger lats. Therefore train lats with rows after chins.

Doing both these things has helped my strength, I think.

I don't follow 5/3/1 by the way, I ordered it months and months ago and have been told since not to follow it as I'm a beginner. It's still a good read though.