Benching for Oly lifts

[Goosey]

Let's look at it objectively.

Which muscles are doing the mechanical work when performing the barbell bench press?

And it's not the pec's.

Is and should the barbell bench press, as an exercise be a simple exercise?

 

[0ni]

I think you'll find Pendlay doesn't have his athletes do bench, unless they are kids, novice, or as Swervyn-Ervyn said, for the right athlete. He doesn't just prescribe to every athlete that walks through the door as you are suggesting


I believe you'll find that pressing will improve your bench, not the other way around.


As I said, I'm going to go with personal experience (which was what my post was all about in the first place) and what Greg has written fits with what I have found personally. If you want to bench, snatch and clean and jerk, then go for it, let me know how it works out for you.


Just out of interest, what is your best snatch (full snatch, not power) and best clean and jerk (full clean, not power, and split jerk)?

I didn't suggest that Pendlay gave a blanket prescription to bench at all. I said that Pendlay has his athletes bench. "unless they are kids, novice, or as Swervyn-Ervyn said, for the right athlete."? Well no shit he prescribes the right exercise for the right athlete.
I said that a novice needs to get strong, so you're saying that bench is a bad choice unless you're doing it for the reasons why I already said it was good? The bench will drive up the press and vice versa. If you're stronger then you're stronger.

I really wouldn't bring in the appeals to authority either mate, you can't carry that shit off to someone who muscle snatches your worksets and muscle cleans more than your max without having trained the traditional lifts a day in his life

 

[0ni]

Let's look at it objectively.

Which muscles are doing the mechanical work when performing the barbell bench press?

And it's not the pec's.

Is and should the barbell bench press, as an exercise be a simple exercise?

If you think of it as a supine press it's great. Flat back, close grip. Great for the triceps, deltoids and pecs. Especially in earlier years when strength is an issue you can easily handle your best jerk and get used to feeling heavier weights. Would Klokov improve his max C+J by benching? Probably not. Is the bench a good exercise for someone that can't C+J 140kg yet? Absolutely. A novice will really lack pressing power, you can't rely on shoving the weight up alone- at some point you'll be shoving up more than you can support, even in the push press

 

[Brick]

I didn't suggest that Pendlay gave a blanket prescription to bench at all. I said that Pendlay has his athletes bench. "unless they are kids, novice, or as Swervyn-Ervyn said, for the right athlete."? Well no shit he prescribes the right exercise for the right athlete.
I said that a novice needs to get strong, so you're saying that bench is a bad choice unless you're doing it for the reasons why I already said it was good? The bench will drive up the press and vice versa. If you're stronger then you're stronger.

I really wouldn't bring in the appeals to authority either mate, you can't carry that shit off to someone who muscle snatches your worksets and muscle cleans more than your max without having trained the traditional lifts a day in his life

 

[Goosey]

Is the consensus thinking that the bench press is not a requirement for the oly lifter?

If that is the case, then you're all drongos.

 

[0ni]

Is the consensus thinking that the bench press is not a requirement for the oly lifter?

If that is the case, then you're all drongos.

The main issue seems to be that benching makes your pecs tighter than any amount of stretching can unfuck (even if you're benching once a fortnight) and that a sport where the object is to lift the most weight has anything to do with being strong is absurd

 

[Goosey]

The main issue seems to be that benching makes your pecs tighter than any amount of stretching can unfuck (even if you're benching once a fortnight) and that a sport where the object is to lift the most weight has anything to do with being strong is absurd

Oh dear.

 

[Darkoz]

I thought this thread was about weightlifting shoes

 

[High Road]

I didn't suggest that Pendlay gave a blanket prescription to bench at all. I said that Pendlay has his athletes bench. "unless they are kids, novice, or as Swervyn-Ervyn said, for the right athlete."? Well no shit he prescribes the right exercise for the right athlete.
I said that a novice needs to get strong, so you're saying that bench is a bad choice unless you're doing it for the reasons why I already said it was good? The bench will drive up the press and vice versa. If you're stronger then you're stronger.

I really wouldn't bring in the appeals to authority either mate, you can't carry that shit off to someone who muscle snatches your worksets and muscle cleans more than your max without having trained the traditional lifts a day in his life

Clips of awesome don't seem to be loading...


Oh, you think that I think I snatch and clean and jerk more than anyone else on here so my word is as good as gold. The old biggest bloke in gym must know what he is talking about, right? Wrong, what I was looking at here is the difference in shoulder flexibility required for a full depth snatch/overhead squat. I know my lifts aren't nothing special, I've said that already.


You seem to be angry young lad that feels like he needs to be right about everything, bit insecure maybe? Maybe just a dickhead? I dunno. As I have said many times in the discussion, I'm talking about myself and what I feel like I need and require. You want to keep talking about blokes you have seen on YouTube. If you want to bench press the house down to improve you snatch and clean and jerk, do it.

 

[Goosey]

I thought this thread was about weightlifting shoes

Pie?

 

[High Road]

Is the bench a good exercise for someone that can't C+J 140kg yet? Absolutely. A novice will really lack pressing power, you can't rely on shoving the weight up alone- at some point you'll be shoving up more than you can support, even in the push press

Farks me how a bigger bench will help someone clean more weight...but seriously, tell me more...

 

[0ni]

Farks me how a bigger bench will help someone clean more weight...but seriously, tell me more...

It's a press... it helps with the jerk

 

[Darkoz]

Pie?

Yes please

 

[Darkoz]

The more I squat the more I jerk

 

[High Road]

It's a press... it helps with the jerk

Oh shit, you're right, my mistake, I didn't see it until now. I'm adding it to my programming right away. Why didn't I see this before??


This thread reminds me of the time Rip tried to tell John North that he was training wrong...

I think I'll just leave this one to experts on here, clearly I'm well out of my depth

 

[0ni]

Clips of awesome don't seem to be loading...


Oh, you think that I think I snatch and clean and jerk more than anyone else on here so my word is as good as gold. The old biggest bloke in gym must know what he is talking about, right? Wrong, what I was looking at here is the difference in shoulder flexibility required for a full depth snatch/overhead squat. I know my lifts aren't nothing special, I've said that already.


You seem to be angry young lad that feels like he needs to be right about everything, bit insecure maybe? Maybe just a dickhead? I dunno. As I have said many times in the discussion, I'm talking about myself and what I feel like I need and require. You want to keep talking about blokes you have seen on YouTube. If you want to bench press the house down to improve you snatch and clean and jerk, do it.

Sweet cognitive dissonance bro
Benching once a week or fortnight will not fuck your flexibility up so much that you can no longer snatch or jerk. You can stretch as well and do soft tissue work

 

[Goosey]

Insert relevant names where applicable....

Let's say I'm on a forum. This forum is called "Simple Pleasures".

The topic of the thread is "Dogs Fucking"

I write "I like watching two dogs fucking, with a third dog looking on." I mean, how simple is that, it's an opinion, and it's valid, because that's what I like to see...two dogs fucking with another dog looking at them.

------will immediately bust in on the conversation.

First he'll say this:

"I like watching two dogs fucking with a cat looking on."

Then he'll appeal to authority:

"Pegg is cat watching dogs fuck guy (OMG another one!) that really knows his shit. When he went against the Dog Whisperer he said he realized right then that he had to make sure a cat was watching those dogs fuck. He spent his time prioritizing on getting after that cat to watch those dogs fuck (cats watching dogs fuck?!?! Lou Simmons says no one needs cats to watch dogs fuck!) and that's what brought he fucking likes.

Then he'll really sink it in:

"The way Stan Efferding thinks is similar to how I think. Get the cat involved in the dog fucking, Open a can of tuna if you have to. Sometime maybe wet food or maybe even some canned salmon. That is how you watch dogs fucking!"

Then he'll throw you little bit of a bone.

"Stan fucking Efferding likes watching two dogs fucking with a cat looking on too, and thinks that, at the very least, something should be watching the dogs fuck except yourself...a hamster, a bird...I don't know, even another dog in a pinch."

 

[Darkoz]

Fucken

[MENTION=3627]Silverback[/MENTION]; We really should have a drink one day Andy

 

[Brick]

Farks me how a bigger bench will help someone clean more weight...but seriously, tell me more...

I think the point you are missing is at our level, that of pretty shitty lifters (lets be honest) that getting stronger period will make you better at the O lifts.

I can tell you, and this is in all seriousness if you trained hard in the power moves for 6 months and ate big you could return to O lifting and better your current lifts.

All the fancy bullshit coach advice does not apply to people who aren't athletes.

Get strong first, then get skilled in and start training specifically for your sport.

 

[High Road]

I think the point you are missing is at our level, that of pretty shitty lifters (lets be honest) that getting stronger period will make you better at the O lifts.

I can tell you, and this is in all seriousness if you trained hard in the power moves for 6 months and ate big you could return to O lifting and better your current lifts.

All the fancy bullshit coach advice does not apply to people who aren't athletes.

Get strong first, then get skilled in and start training specifically for your sport.

Mate, I do what I do because I enjoy it, I'm 35years old, I'm past my used by date in a sport that I am only really just getting into. I'm not about to stop doing what I'm doing to go and get strong because some bloke on the Internet said to. Thanks all the same