Goosey
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One Bar or Two.
Yea they do. Would be keen to check them out if I end up going for two seperate bars. Good to support local business too hey!
Karak
New member
Mainly for certified calibration and tighter mass tolerances matey.
Also prices in Aus is ridiculous due to the middle-man fees. I cant see these bars costing more than AUD$500 from the factory.
Goosey
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So the fundamental or essential difference between the two should be the accuracy of the bar weight and tolerance of load?
not the knurling.
Karak
New member
Yes - but having used both training and comp bars of comparable manufacture dates, i can say unequivocally, the training bars knurling are not as aggressive.
From a practical standpoint, this is something you can actually notice as a difference between the bars.
rino60
Member
I'm another advocate for the ABC Bar - one of my newest home gym additions - but I certainly couldn't recommend it for Olympic lifts. It's just honestly too resistive to collar spin with a decent weight on.
That said, if I was going for 'one bar only' and intended on doing both, I'd perhaps go the ABC Power Bar, but request Needle Bearings. You'll have a terrible time doing big back squats or bench with a whippy oly bar, so a stiff bar with 'smooth' collars is your cover all solution.
If you're serious about powerlifting, into weightlifting and can just stretch the budget to include a second bar, a suggestion would be one of the Crossfit/WL Oly Bars offered by Sam's Fitness for the second bar.
I should note that I've got the ABC Power Bar for outside the rack, and a terrible needle bearing bar for inside the rack and oly lifting. Cannot recommend GymDirect any less - other than for the MM Commercial Rack.
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That said, if I was going for 'one bar only' and intended on doing both, I'd perhaps go the ABC Power Bar, but request Needle Bearings. You'll have a terrible time doing big back squats or bench with a whippy oly bar, so a stiff bar with 'smooth' collars is your cover all solution.
If you're serious about powerlifting, into weightlifting and can just stretch the budget to include a second bar, a suggestion would be one of the Crossfit/WL Oly Bars offered by Sam's Fitness for the second bar.
I should note that I've got the ABC Power Bar for outside the rack, and a terrible needle bearing bar for inside the rack and oly lifting. Cannot recommend GymDirect any less - other than for the MM Commercial Rack.
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[MENTION=10544]rino60[/MENTION]; - thanks for the input mate! I hadn't thought of getting the ABC bar with needle barings. Genius!
I'm 99% sure ill be getting my rack from Sam's so if you recon their bar is ok I might suss it out. Have you had any first hand experience with it?
BTW, that pic of your bar is sweeeet. It makes me want one
Cheers for putting it up!
I'm 99% sure ill be getting my rack from Sam's so if you recon their bar is ok I might suss it out. Have you had any first hand experience with it?
BTW, that pic of your bar is sweeeet. It makes me want one
Cheers for putting it up!
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J
JackHart
Guest
I could be wrong, but I would guess that the bars they make that end up within the +/-20g tolerance get the "comp" sticker, and the ones that end up out of the tolerance get the "training" sticker
I'm not sure how much weight knurling would take off the bar, but I am guessing that would also be part of the factor with deciding which sticker it gets. (i.e., too heavy, more knurling, too light, less knurling).
Quick update
I called ABC and asked if this could be done but they were a bit... well... vague really. They told me that they couldn't do the BOP220 with needle bearings and that if I wanted something like that, I should choose a different bar all together. So with this in mind, I asked about how different the whip is between one of their Oly bars and the power bar. I was told that there is no difference at all because all their products use the same bars (shafts) and it's only the knurling and bearings that differ. I also asked what the shaft diameters were and the answer was "between 28mm and 29mm". PSI rating... "not sure". I decided to give up and check out the downloadable specs from their website but that wasn't much help either. In the specs, they show the collar diameter as being "50mm aprox"! Can their tolerances and QC really be this loose?
When you compere this to the Rogue site that not only shows all the specs in detail, but also has vids that show how the things are made, its hard to keep the faith that the ABC bars the better choice
http://www.rogueaustralia.com.au/the-ohio-bar-au
The only thing I know for sure is that Ive got 140kg of bumper plates sitting in the shed that aren't going to lift themselves!
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rino60
Member
[MENTION=10544]rino60[/MENTION]; - thanks for the input mate! I hadn't thought of getting the ABC bar with needle barings. Genius!
I'm 99% sure ill be getting my rack from Sam's so if you recon their bar is ok I might suss it out. Have you had any first hand experience with it?
BTW, that pic of your bar is sweeeet. It makes me want one
Which Sam's rack are you thinking of getting? I've used a couple of them, and reckon they're pretty good kit.
I've had limited first hand experience with a few of the Sam's stocked ATX bars, and found them quite well built. Not sure about durability but feel was good, and build quality high.
No worries RE the pic. I'll be doing up a gym thread soon, just waiting on the latest few purchases to show up.
rino60
Member
Quick update
I called ABC and asked if this could be done but they were a bit... well... vague really. They told me that they couldn't do the BOP220 with needle bearings and that if I wanted something like that, I should choose a different bar all together. So with this in mind, I asked about how different the whip is between one of their Oly bars and the power bar. I was told that there is no difference at all because all their products use the same bars (shafts) and it's only the knurling and bearings that differ. I also asked what the shaft diameters were and the answer was "between 28mm and 29mm". PSI rating... "not sure". I decided to give up and check out the downloadable specs from their website but that wasn't much help either. In the specs, they show the collar diameter as being "50mm aprox"! Can their tolerances and QC really be this loose?
When you compere this to the Rogue site that not only shows all the specs in detail, but also has vids that show how the things are made, its hard to keep the faith that the ABC bars the better choice
http://www.rogueaustralia.com.au/the-ohio-bar-au
The only thing I know for sure is that Ive got 140kg of bumper plates sitting in the shed that aren't going to lift themselves!
I'll be the first to admit that ABCs customer service didn't instil great confidence in me, but after trying a couple of their bars that had spent 18 months in the power racks (funnily enough the same MM racks that I have) at 'Iron Strength' up in Cairns, I was sold.
These bars looked as good as the day they were shipped.
Durability is what you're getting with ABC, and I'm yet to see a bar comparably enduring in anything near the same price point. I should note that I've got 300kg of bumpers from Hellion, and those puppies have tight tolerances. They fit the ABC Bar like a glove.
That said, I'm eyeing off a Rogue Ohio Power Bar, which I might get for Christmas. Either that or a Texas DL bar... I would have no hesitation in going another ABC should this one clap out, but don't see that happening any time soon, so why not diversify?
Don't get me wrong, they were friendly and tried to help. They just weren't big on the details. :-/
This is 50% of the equation for me. I love things that last but the functionality has to be there too.
Nice! I've heard those Hellions are sweeeet! Lucky man. I'm pretty happy with the Pendlays so far... you know... without actually having used them yet haha
In terms of fit, I know Pendlay recommend Rogue bars as they are 50mm collars and the plates are 50.4mm. That's why I was interested in knowing what the ABC collars were. Given that you've already got the ABC power bar and you can't see it dying any time soon, what's the thinking behind having more than one power bar?
Im looking at either the Barbarian commercial or Barbarian Pro rack. Still not sure if I want/need the plate storage or if being able to add the lat tower down the track would be better. They both feel solid as a rock and I can't see myself out growing or out using either! The other rack I was looking at was the Muscle Motion commercial rack but haven't seen that one up close.
It seems like 90% of the gear at Sams is pretty good. Nice to hear the bars are too!
Now this I'm looking forward to! Sounds like your going through the same process as me. Would be sweet to compare set ups once we're both done!
rino60
Member
Don't get me wrong, they were friendly and tried to help. They just weren't big on the details. :-/
This is 50% of the equation for me. I love things that last but the functionality has to be there too.
Nice! I've heard those Hellions are sweeeet! Lucky man. I'm pretty happy with the Pendlays so far... you know... without actually having used them yet haha
Given that you've already got the ABC power bar and you can't see it dying any time soon, what's the thinking behind having more than one power bar?
Im looking at either the Barbarian commercial or Barbarian Pro rack. Still not sure if I want/need the plate storage or if being able to add the lat tower down the track would be better. They both feel solid as a rock and I can't see myself out growing or out using either! The other rack I was looking at was the Muscle Motion commercial rack but haven't seen that one up close.
It seems like 90% of the gear at Sams is pretty good. Nice to hear the bars are too!
Now this I'm looking forward to! Sounds like your going through the same process as me. Would be sweet to compare set ups once we're both done!
I've just measured the sleeves in a few places, and they are very consistently D50.0-50.1mm. Measured the shaft, and I'm looking at D28.8-29.0mm relatively consistently across the shaft - no rapid variations, straight as an arrow. Minor variation in knurl - only if I'm being extremely pedantic. Nothing approaching enough to consider it below par in any way.
The Hellion Plates are outstanding. Ever so slightly thicker rubber than stainless centre, so they lock into a solid mass when clamped or stacked.
I'd like a second bar to have a good bar in the rack, a good bar on the deck (both predominantly for power lifts), then my rubbish MM bar for Oly lifts
I've got the MM Commercial Power Rack, and have the following thoughts:
Pros: Strong as an ox, heavy (200kg) and stable. Welded joining plates makes assemble simple, and rigid as all heck - no requirement to bolt down. You honestly have no idea how handy plate storage is, and unless space was a proper issue, I'd personally not get a rack without it. Great pullup bar.
Cons: Plate storage is fixed spacing (due 'tapered fixtures' that you'd have to drill massive holes in rack to move) and this spacing does NOT allow bumpers on adjacent hooks. Mine are currently on bottom, mid and upper of the five, with the 2nd from bottom holding fractionals and the 2nd from top holding clamps. Sable type safeties are a pain. Not a massive issue (my bench and squat safety are same height), but turn and drop are better. No band pegs. J Hooks (4 of) don't have plastic or other protection for the bar. No walk through (not an issue if rack is facing a wall and the back brace provides a calf raise ledge).
The only thing I'd replacd it with in the Australian market would be a Rogue RML-690 or (lotto dependant) one of the Iron Edge pro racks. Under $2k, the only other rack I'd even consider other than the Barbarian would be the Monsta Rack from rawfitnessequipment.com.au simply due provided accessories (band pegs, torsonator, etc).
I plan on uploading a gym walk through quite soon, once finalised. Will let you know and post when done.
Mate thanks heaps for taking the time to do that! That's exactly what I needed - Legend
I'm not sure why, but even though I'd heard good things about the Hellion plates, i somehow never checked the site for pricing
I cant believe how cheap they are. If I had to guess, id say they are the same plate as the Pendlay/Rogue with different print. At the price they're selling them you'd be mad to get anything else! Ok that makes sense. Guess you can never have too much gear right?
Again thanks for the detailed breakdown. Is interesting the hear your thoughts on the plate storage issue. To be honest im trying to convince myself I don't need it and that the extra money would be better spent on other equipment (like the lat attachment for instance). In fact one of the rationals I had for buying bumpers was that I could make up a basic "toaster rack" to sit either side of the rack, thus negating the need for a weight tree. However, when all is said and done, you'er probably right abut the convenience of dedicated rack based storage :-/ I like the build quality and hole spacing in the Rogue and Iron Edge racks but don't like the chin bars as much as the "monkey bar" style and the 'lotto dependence" for the iron edge gear might be an issue too. I also checked out the Monsta Rack and that thing looks awesome! Again, I cant believe how cheap they are for what you get! Whats the catch? In the grand scheme of things, how would you say the Barbarian racks stack up in terms of quality and "bang for buck"?
Seriously cant wait to see this!
Just wanted to say thanks again for your input mate. I'm pretty analytical (very analytical) when it comes to purchasing equipment but I live in Tasmania and can't just go in and check the gear out in person, so I rely heavily on info from those who have. Trouble is, a lot of people wont take the time to pass the info on once the excitement of purchasing their own kit wares off. Your thorough and well thought out information is absolutely golden. Much respect to you mate!
rino60
Member
Thanks mate - happy to help. When I do my gym video, I'll do a review of most of the bits of kit that I've got.
I'd considered the same for plate storage, but would likely only so that with some of the plates to sit alongside my deadlift platform. Ain't nobody want to be picking up plates from the floor to load the bar for squats, but if I had a permanent place, I'd consider something without plate storage and mount finger type holders on the wall.
The Barbarian is a good build, and Matt and the team at Sam's offer great customer service - I've dealt with them four or five times. There are a few things that I personally don't like about the Barbarian Pro (plate storage style, etc) but it is solidly built, and quite a European feel.
Actually went and tried out a monsta rack the other day. While it certainly looked a little Chinese (paint finish and some of the brackets), it was an absolute beast and the pullups rail and band pegs were top notch.
Quick update
I called ABC and asked if this could be done but they were a bit... well... vague really. They told me that they couldn't do the BOP220 with needle bearings and that if I wanted something like that, I should choose a different bar all together. So with this in mind, I asked about how different the whip is between one of their Oly bars and the power bar. I was told that there is no difference at all because all their products use the same bars (shafts) and it's only the knurling and bearings that differ. I also asked what the shaft diameters were and the answer was "between 28mm and 29mm". PSI rating... "not sure". I decided to give up and check out the downloadable specs from their website but that wasn't much help either. In the specs, they show the collar diameter as being "50mm aprox"! Can their tolerances and QC really be this loose?
When you compere this to the Rogue site that not only shows all the specs in detail, but also has vids that show how the things are made, its hard to keep the faith that the ABC bars the better choice
http://www.rogueaustralia.com.au/the-ohio-bar-au
The only thing I know for sure is that Ive got 140kg of bumper plates sitting in the shed that aren't going to lift themselves!
It's a shame they can't even offer details on their own products. It's extremely disappointing they use the same shaft for their cheapest power bar as their most expensive WL bar. A WL bar NEEDS to be 28mm and can't perform like a WL bar if it's using the same shaft as PL bar. Completely different applications. It needs to be high quality, high PSI steel. It needs specific knurling, so as to provide solid grip in the awkward snatch grip, but not tear the hands up when training every day. I'd love to support local business, but they're just not up to spec, both literally, and business wise, not having the details for their own gear. Uesaka have been making bars since the 30s or 40s, same as ABC. But Uesaka has the highest quality gear in the game. Plates with bores of 50.04mm, weight calibration so precise they even take into account the weight of the stickers. Big difference with ABC who can't offer definite answers to standard barbell specs...
We don't have many options for high quality WL bars in Australia nowadays, unfortunately. Pendlay/Muscle Driver went out of business. My Pendlay needle bar is bent and the zinc finish wore through and the shaft is rusting. This was a $900 bar. Rogue is here, but they charge $850 delivered for their WL bar, and it's not even the good 'Euro' bar. It's the zinc coated, no centre knurl bar, and I'm not going that route ever again.
The IWF companies can always be relied upon for good bars, but we are limited for resellers here these days. Eleiko is WILDLY overpriced, Uesaka don't list their prices, so you know that's going to sting when you ask. Werksan isn't sold by UGE anymore. Zhang Kong had a reseller for a short while but they disappeared. DHS have a couple of resellers, but I doubt they actually hold any stock, and they charge $900 delivered for the training bar when it should be more like $600, so they can get stuffed too.
Few other local options exist for anything resembling a proper WL bar. The Iron Edge bar seems nice until you look at the specs and find it's not even 28mm. That's about it, then you're down to the dregs of el cheapo Chinese crossfit bars. They boast the right specs, but at those low prices, are guaranteed to either a) be lying, and/or b) bend imediately. Then you get to have fun with warranties...
The only real option right now is to pay through the nose for Eleiko or Uesaka, and maybe DHS. The other two or three IWF companies will require dealing with international headaches and shipping, without the luxury of a local reseller to take that on for you (for a hefty fee of course)
I wonder if ABC has the capacity to release a legit, high quality weightlifting bar at around $1000 to rival Uesaka and Eleiko. That's the price of these bars in other countries without the good old Straya tax. If they could do it, I'd be interested in buying one, but as it stands, I can't give ~$700 to a company that just doesn't offer the quality required of that kind of money. I guess that ABC mostly deals with customers that don't need precision, like commercial gyms. And up until the last ten or so years, it was even harder than now to get ahold of the high-end legit overseas gear for a reasonable price, so they didn't need to compete, because they were the only option. I nearly fell over the other day when I saw they were offering a new model of bumper plate, their first since the 90s as far as I can tell. It looks to be the same as the Chinese model of plate that Eleiko uses for their cheaper Eleiko Sport plates. They're even reasonably priced. That is, if the prices listed are for pairs and not singles. If it's for single plates, tell 'em they're dreamin'.
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