Why are box squats harder

[NightFallTech]

Without a box your not doing box squats.

Didn't you say in another post you had a squat of 180??? or something around that but it halved when you tried to go to depth. Maybe you've just got too much weight on the bar. Go light enough so you can get arse to ground and then start gradually adding weight continuing with arse to ground form.

It can be pretty humbling when you start doing lifts with strict form.

I can't get arse to ground with no weight and holding onto something for balance and pushing myself down, so I'm working from below parrellel with heels on plates at present and stretching

Yesterday was 70kg as deep as my flexibility lets me go with a sit in the bottom for a bit and then up (x5), limiting factor on weight is an inner thigh muscle that feels about to snap from the stretch, but I don't have a lot more in the tank from that depth, probably even less if I could get ATG!

 

[The Hamburgler]

I want to try these now to see how much I can box squat.
How would these help in powerlifting?

Having seen you squat in person probably not
You've got a hell of a lot of improvement left just in your squat by just improving your squat

Plus what Bazza said

 

[Zoot]

If your squatting in gear, yep but raw squatting a lot of people don't get great carryover.

I have bugger-all posterior chain strength, and I've also just been through that humbling experience where you realise your form is crap, you start squatting ATG and your numbers go down to 60% of what you thought they were.

I was hoping that the box squats would help me build some glutes and teach me to overcome my quad dominance. Am I wasting my time?

 

[LAandE]

I can't get arse to ground with no weight and holding onto something for balance and pushing myself down, so I'm working from below parrellel with heels on plates at present and stretching

Yesterday was 70kg as deep as my flexibility lets me go with a sit in the bottom for a bit and then up (x5), limiting factor on weight is an inner thigh muscle that feels about to snap from the stretch, but I don't have a lot more in the tank from that depth, probably even less if I could get ATG!

Brick didn't say not to use any weight at all. He said go light enough that you can get good depth and increase the weight from there, whilst keeping good depth.

In other words, 140kg quarter squats are probably not as good as 60kg ATG squats, for the average gym goer.

 

[Sumo]

I have bugger-all posterior chain strength, and I've also just been through that humbling experience where you realise your form is crap, you start squatting ATG and your numbers go down to 60% of what you thought they were.

I was hoping that the box squats would help me build some glutes and teach me to overcome my quad dominance. Am I wasting my time?

No you are not wasting your time if you use the correct technique.

If you can get access to a Glute Ham Raise machine (its not really a machine) that would be very good at building posterior chain as well - if you dont have access to one there are some good instructional videos on YouTube on building a poor mans GHR. Its not that difficult.

 

[Bazza20]

No you are not wasting your time if you use the correct technique.

If you can get access to a Glute Ham Raise machine (its not really a machine) that would be very good at building posterior chain as well - if you dont have access to one there are some good instructional videos on YouTube on building a poor mans GHR. Its not that difficult.

If you dont have a GHR do SLDLs. Even though I have a GHR I think that SLDLs are a better exercise anyway.

 

[Goosey]

MOre often than not STiff legged deadlifts are trickier to learn and teach than squatting.

 

[NightFallTech]

Brick didn't say not to use any weight at all. He said go light enough that you can get good depth and increase the weight from there, whilst keeping good depth.

In other words, 140kg quarter squats are probably not as good as 60kg ATG squats, for the average gym goer.

Understood and my approach now... haven't done a single squat above parallel since reading this forum

Problem is just that no matter how light, i need plates under my heels and i the stretch into the bottom hurts more than the lift

hopefully this will eventually be fixed with enough stretching.

I'm quite possibly the least flexible person on this forum (I can't sit cross legged without pain)

 

[Zoot]

there are some good instructional videos on YouTube on building a poor mans GHR. Its not that difficult.

Thanks Sumo, I reckon I might have a crack at this. If nothing else it'll be potential fodder for the what you saw at the gym today thread

 

[Danimal]

Understood and my approach now... haven't done a single squat above parallel since reading this forum

Problem is just that no matter how light, i need plates under my heels and i the stretch into the bottom hurts more than the lift

hopefully this will eventually be fixed with enough stretching.

I'm quite possibly the least flexible person on this forum (I can't sit cross legged without pain)

Force those knees out.

 

[bams_101]

I don't actually have a box, I'm just pausing a lot at the bottom while i try to find my depth and stretch....

If it wasn't miles away and presumably booked up till 2020 PTC frankston would be my pick based on what i've seen around these forums .

I know my flexibility is crap, giving myself a month to work on that, then i'll get some hands on help if i can't progress with 'internet help'

Lol so you're doing PAUSED squats. The mechanics are different when comparing a box squat to a free squat since you can sit back further than you be able to normally without one. Then there's squatting to a box which is also different in that the box is just used to check depth.

I've also seen the video of your squats and yeah the plates will help but theyre a band aid. Find out which muscles are tight and then you can figure out where to go from there-

Id say the usual suspects to check would be "tight/overactive" muscle groups like the hip flexors, calves and pec/pec minor in your case thanks to the chest caving in at the bottom of the squat.

"Weak and inhibited" muscle groups glutes, upper back and lats.

Since you said you also have a sore groin/couldnt sit cross legged- this could be from a muscle called the adductor magnus along adducting the leg (think lat raises for the leg) it also extends the hip like the hamstings. The hammies could be in either one of the above categories and force other muscles to compensate for their ineffectiveness.

I think you should take Goosey's advice and try goblet squats. They are a great foundation if you plan to progress to full squats. They can be performed pretty heavy as an assistance exercise too, I've gone as high as 70s at my old gym.

 

[bams_101]

If you dont have a GHR do SLDLs. Even though I have a GHR I think that SLDLs are a better exercise anyway.

Which GHR have you got man? Im pretty sure if you think SLDL's or RDL's are better then I could tell you a couple of variations that'll make you nice and sore haha =)

 

[0ni]

About a year ago when I was squatting something like 80 or 90kg for sets of 5, I could do "box squats" in the fashion mentioned above with something ridiculous like 140kg for a few reps. These were at parallel

Also goblet squats are great, Dan John recommends them. I've shown a few people in the gym how to squat with half decent form by getting them to do these although they lose their shit again when they go back to the bar lol

 

[bams_101]

About a year ago when I was squatting something like 80 or 90kg for sets of 5, I could do "box squats" in the fashion mentioned above with something ridiculous like 140kg for a few reps. These were at parallel

Also goblet squats are great, Dan John recommends them. I've shown a few people in the gym how to squat with half decent form by getting them to do these although they lose their shit again when they go back to the bar lol

Haha yeah I know what you mean there, but its because there's no middle ground in that transition. If you slotted front squat as a progression between goblet and back squat they might hold form a little better. Also depends on their bar position too.

So a year ago, you were squatting 140 to a parallel box for some reps. What can you box squat now? Going off your 80-90x5 sets, 1RM wouldve been ~110ish at the time? So you were using an exercise that allowed a 25% overload compared to you normal squat and you stopped doing that, why????

Another option is you were doing the exercise incorrectly. Not having a dig, just stating a possibility.

 

[Bazza20]

Which GHR have you got man? Im pretty sure if you think SLDL's or RDL's are better then I could tell you a couple of variations that'll make you nice and sore haha =)

I can make my Hams plenty sore on it but I go by results. My dead and squat didn't really move at all when I started hammering out glute hams. Time was better off spent doing things like more squats and SLDLs.

 

[NightFallTech]

I can make my Hams plenty sore on it but I go by results. My dead and squat didn't really move at all when I started hammering out glute hams. Time was better off spent doing things like more squats and SLDLs.

Deads and squats aren't the only movements in the world... did you test your glute pelvic thrust on the dance floor?

 

[Zoot]

did you test your glute pelvic thrust

Man, I've been doing these weighted glute bridges [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m75lHgzxpI"](eek)[/ame] of late, but they make me feel kinda dirty. It takes everything I've got not to grunt, that would just be a little too much.

 

[Brick]

Deads and squats aren't the only movements in the world... )

Correct there is bench and ohp as well. Everything else is assistance or bro science lol.

 

[0ni]

Haha yeah I know what you mean there, but its because there's no middle ground in that transition. If you slotted front squat as a progression between goblet and back squat they might hold form a little better. Also depends on their bar position too.

So a year ago, you were squatting 140 to a parallel box for some reps. What can you box squat now? Going off your 80-90x5 sets, 1RM wouldve been ~110ish at the time? So you were using an exercise that allowed a 25% overload compared to you normal squat and you stopped doing that, why????

Another option is you were doing the exercise incorrectly. Not having a dig, just stating a possibility.

Because when I went back to normal squatting, I completely shit the bed and wasn't stronger

 

[rino60]

MOre often than not STiff legged deadlifts are trickier to learn and teach than squatting.

They are, hands down, one of THE HARDEST exercises to teach.

And the hardest thing for me is that the first time I tried them, they simply worked. So trying to understand how a person can't just do them is unfathomable.