• Keep up to date with Ausbb via Twitter and Facebook. Please add us!
  • Join the Ausbb - Australian BodyBuilding forum

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

    The Ausbb - Australian BodyBuilding forum is dedicated to no nonsense muscle and strength building. If you need advice that works, you have come to the right place. This forum focuses on building strength and muscle using the basics. You will also find that the Ausbb- Australian Bodybuilding Forum stresses encouragement and respect. Trolls and name calling are not allowed here. No matter what your personal goals are, you will be given effective advice that produces results.

    Please consider registering. It takes 30 seconds, and will allow you to get the most out of the forum.

Training Frequency

spartacus said:
my view: I think very intense training once a week per muscle can still work, at least for muscle growth. If once per week works for people on drugs, I do not see how the same approach could not work for naturals. Doe not make sense to me.

But, for most sports, which requires a skill element, I would always think multiple times are needed.
Click to expand...

The point of the thread was that protein synthesis for Natty lifters only remains elevated for 48 hours after a muscle is worked. Therefore the most gains are going to be made in those first 48 hours. So waiting a whole week to train a bodypart again is not optimal.

Geared lifters can get away with it, as gear increases your protein synthesis, so the 48 hour elevated protein synthesis doesn't apply so much to geared lifters.
 
i can only say my gut feeling is that once a week flat out intensity may work for some.

I am not going to argue about something that can only be quantified by studies. Are there any?
 
spartacus said:
i can only say my gut feeling is that once a week flat out intensity may work for some.

I am not going to argue about something that can only be quantified by studies. Are there any?
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that there would be a mountain of research out there showing the 48 hour protein synthesis theory is correct. You here it all the time from Layne Norton, Steve Shaw etc. If I have the time sometime I'll try to dig it up. :)
 
No, I am sure that is probably correct.

But why would that mean that 100% intensity once per week will not work.

There are many factors that influence muscle and strength gain.

Personally, i feel better doing lots of moderate intensity work, with occasional 100% intensity 9once every 2-3 weeks).

But i am confident there would be some nattys out there that could improve on once per week flat out intensity.
 
El Stiffy said:
Haha I remember buying the Matrix training book. Back in early 1990s or something
@Shrek ; will probably remember the Matrix training principles. all those partial rep stuff.

Probably not a very credible routine to follow. He fell off the scene very quickly.
Click to expand...

true, but there are other studies that support occasional flat out intensity and nothing more.
 
but, like i said already, most of us do sports where breakdown of training is necessary: skill, strength and so on.

I cannot really comment on those just wanting to be bigger. not my thing.
 
spartacus said:
but, like i said already, most of us do sports where breakdown of training is necessary: skill, strength and so on.

I cannot really comment on those just wanting to be bigger. not my thing.
Click to expand...

yep, I do and have almost always done Boxing and MMA stuff on my cardio or Off days and run the Upper/Lower twice a week splits. It is just a bit too much though I feel. Recovery for me is about 4 days usually.
 
I started off doing something like this.

Chest / Tri
Back / Bi
Legs / Shoulders

Twice per week.

Results were had for a while then bang....nothing..............for a very long time
 
i am not saying once per week is optimal even for muscle growth; all i am saying is that i feel some may improve from once per week training if intensity was hard enough.

It makes sense, the greater the intensity, the less frequent you can train for a sustained period.

Personally, i am into volume and peaking every now and then with maximum intensity.

As we have all said, however, the ability to recover from maximum intensity will vary from individual to individual.

One needs to find out there own personal threshold in terms of frequency intensity.
 
El Stiffy said:
Not disputing that, just disputing that the once per week body part split is optimal for the natural lifter.

Most champion Bodybuilders are on gear. Gear increases protein synthesis, which means their muscles require less frequent stimulation.
Click to expand...

I would argue that to capitalise on exogenous hormones you should train more frequently or intensely due to improved recovery ability. I don't believe that a large muscle will be anywhere fully recovered in 48 hours. I get DOMS that last longer than that sometimes, and lack of DOMS doesn't necessarily equate to complete recovery. PS I train each body part once a week. Always open to something new though as I have been feeling like I'm stuck in a bit of a rut of late....I don't see how you can incorporate two sessions per body part at enough intensity to stimulate growth in a realistic amount of time, that's my main issue.
 
Repacked said:
I would argue that to capitalise on exogenous hormones you should train more frequently or intensely due to improved recovery ability. I don't believe that a large muscle will be anywhere fully recovered in 48 hours. I get DOMS that last longer than that sometimes, and lack of DOMS doesn't necessarily equate to complete recovery. PS I train each body part once a week. Always open to something new though as I have been feeling like I'm stuck in a bit of a rut of late....I don't see how you can incorporate two sessions per body part at enough intensity to stimulate growth in a realistic amount of time, that's my main issue.
Click to expand...

Not saying to train a body part every 48 hours, just that protein synthesis is only elevated for 48 hours post training. Therefore the amount of times you can be in that 48 hour increased protein synthesis "window" is optimal. For nattys!

I think there is a happy medium somewhere between the "once per week" frequency and the every 48 hour frequency. That's why for me I think its somewhere around 4 days.

Recovery usually takes longer than 48 hours.
 
But if you're training daily there is a constant stimulus for protein synthesis. I believe this would have a systemic effect, especially long term. Are there any physiologists out there??
 
Repacked said:
But if you're training daily there is a constant stimulus for protein synthesis. I believe this would have a systemic effect, especially long term. Are there any physiologists out there??
Click to expand...

yep, but the more you split your training the more isolated the muscle stimulation and repair is.
 
El Stiffy said:
yep, but the more you split your training the more isolated the muscle stimulation and repair is.
Click to expand...

Yeah but htere is rarely no overlap between muscle groups, especially if you employ some compound exercises, and surely the rate of protein synthesis occurs along a spectrum not simply elevated or not.

I'm actually debating whether I used to get equivalent or better results doing a 3 day split once per week. I think my main challenge is recovery. There are only three ways to increase that, rest more, train less or get on your bike.
 
So are we talking about the same amount of training here?

For example and using the 2 opposite ends of the spectrum.
Opt 1 - 5-day split routine, 1 hour sessions. Each muscle gets worked once, but fatigued to the point that it's overloaded.
Opt 2 - Full body workout every day for 5 days, 1 hour sessions. Each muscle is worked every day, but not to the point of fatigue or beyond its limits.

So you're saying that option 2 will give better results. Essentially that frequency is more important than intensity.
 
steveP said:
So are we talking about the same amount of training here?

For example and using the 2 opposite ends of the spectrum.
Opt 1 - 5-day split routine, 1 hour sessions. Each muscle gets worked once, but fatigued to the point that it's overloaded.
Opt 2 - Full body workout every day for 5 days, 1 hour sessions. Each muscle is worked every day, but not to the point of fatigue or beyond its limits.

So you're saying that option 2 will give better results. Essentially that frequency is more important than intensity.
Click to expand...

me? No, what I'm saying is splitting training so body parts are only trained once a week isn't optimal. Perhaps training body parts every 4-5 days is optimal. It seems to be to me.
But going from once a week to every 4-5 days may initially be taxing until your body adapts.
 
steveP said:
But to train the same muscle group more frequently, you need to reduce the volume,
Click to expand...

Maybe, maybe not. If your currently only training body parts once a week, you might be able to go to training them once every 6 days, then once every 5 days etc. Depends on how your body adapts, but you need to give it time for your body to adapt to the higher frequency.

But the more of those 48 hour increased protein synthesis periods you can get into, the more you will gain.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top