body proportions and hitting squat depth

[0ni]

I'm all about the moon

 

[Chisholm]

No one gives a fuck, but here's my opinion.

- A squat that isn't hammies on calves is not a fucking squat, it's a partial squat. Squatting to just parallel is a half squat.

- What the fuck is it vids of with high squats being passed in comps, especially equipped. Looks fucking retarded to an outsider, no wonder our sport isn't popular.

- If you are too fat, inflexible or have awkward proportions for hitting depth, adjust your squat style. High-bar, narrow stance etc. Oly shoes can also help. A full squat for 100kg is more impressive and useful than a 1/3 squat for 200kg.

 

[The Hamburgler]

If you don't like it why don't you take up WLing or crochet?

 

[NAPARM]

"isn't unpopular" - so you mean it's popular?

 

[0ni]

The whole "If it's not ATG it's not a squat" is just as fucking bad as equipped lifting

 

[Chisholm]

"isn't unpopular" - so you mean it's popular?

slight typo there...edited like it never happened.

The whole "If it's not ATG it's not a squat" is just as fucking bad as equipped lifting

Really? What's stupid about a full depth squat? IMO it looks far more impressive to the general sporting public, and is a better expression of athletic prowess.

I reckon most people would be impressed by a video of an elite oly lifter doing a full squat...a fat dude in a suit doing a partial not so much.

Although purely a matter of opinion, so probably not a point worth debating.

 

[0ni]

slight typo there...edited like it never happened.



Really? What's stupid about a full depth squat? IMO it looks far more impressive to the general sporting public, and is a better expression of athletic prowess.

I reckon most people would be impressed by a video of an elite oly lifter doing a full squat...a fat dude in a suit doing a partial not so much.

Although purely a matter of opinion, so probably not a point worth debating.

Start worrying about doing something before you start worrying about what you aren't doing. Here is a classic photo making the rounds these days

What makes this photo impressive? Is it really the lack of belt, wraps and spotters? I don't know, lets try an experiment.

Also no belt, wraps or spotters. Seems lacking, no?

It's not the "nothing" that makes this stuff impressive. It's the big f-ing weight on his back.

Work on making yourself a badass in any capacity before you start worrying about the stuff you aren't doing. An 800lb deadlift is impressive. That deadlift is impressive with an 8" wide, 20mm thick belt, wraps, and a suit. A man with that sort of pull is impressive, regardless of what he does to do it.

 

[Zoot]

Some awesomely helpful analysis here:

Zoot, for starters, based on the vid you already posted, you need to push your knees out more. Your hips have nowhere to move at the bottom of the squat. If you sit between your legs more, you will find it easier to hit depth without your back rounding. Slightly wider will also help.

Spread the feet and knees more to create a hole to sit into. Sitting back is obviously not working for you, you need to squat down not back.

From what I understand, forward knee travel in your case is not determined by anthropometry but by improper set-up at the beginning of the movement.

Start with a slightly wider stance, point your toes out 30 degrees. Start the squat by throwing your knees out wide, not forward. Ideally the knees should travel out, then lock in position (along with your back angle) about 1/3 of the way down. Concentrate on throwing your knees out, tracking them out over your toes, and locking them there as you sit down & lean forward into the hole. Squat shoes may also help.

Goblet squats with a wide stance...

Knees out, ass down. Bingo, depth

Zoot, this is basically what I learned to do. In fact, the only cue I mentally remind myself of before each set is "knees out", although it's second nature now.

Squatting down and not back means I get to depth OK.

Didn't even believe it until my coach showed me LOL

You don't really need a very wide stance to do that, just slightly wider than shoulder width probably. your adductors should not be overly taxed by it.

From the vid I can see heels coming up off the ground and hips translating forward as you reach your bottom position which causes your knees to do the same (more noticeable in the second rep). ... With your lack of mobility in the hips and ankle and it's going to pretty hard to make depth. Not impossible though.

First would be to see if you can hit depth on a front squat or a goblet squat. If you can hit depth with those then it's either something technical holding you back with your regular squat or a mobility issue.

And a consistent message.

So I've been trying to stretch and fix things along the above lines. My first attempts are here:

improved squat - side - YouTube

improved squat - front view - YouTube


It will cost me 20-30 kilos that I'll need to claw back over time, so most importantly: Would this squat get passed in competition?

 

[D1cko]

so most importantly: Would this squat get passed in competition?

Yep...I reckon it would
BTW...That's a mean set of quads there Zoot...(a bit homo)

 

[nazzysmith]

Yep...I reckon it would
BTW...That's a mean set of quads there Zoot...(a bit homo)

Yeah full homo over here... Zoot your a beast...

I do like the look of your squat now...

Will wait and see what the brains trust has to say...

 

[DCMusic]

It will cost me 20-30 kilos that I'll need to claw back over time, so most importantly: Would this squat get passed in competition?

What's up Zoot.

Yes the depth is good. Stance is perfect.

If I might offer some additional advice?

Avoid stopping at the bottom. Be confident that your depth is good, and use the momentum of the descent to "bounce" out of the hole.

Try to establish a more pronounced back angle, less vertical. Look at your position at the very bottom of the movement. Your back angle is closer to a front squat. Think of the squat as if you are getting underneath a really heavy table, leaning forward and pushing the table up in the air with your hips & ass. Don't be afraid to sit down & lean forward. This will allow your knees to be more stable, allow better hip drive out of the bottom, and eventually allow you to squat far more weight.

 

[nazzysmith]

Interdasting^^^

Allowing more back angle will reduce your knees moving forward...

And off the bottom you wanna bounce of the stretch reflex so to speak...

All good imo...

 

[Sticky]

Looks good now mate.

Don't pause though, you want a quick and definite reversal.

You seem to shift laterally a little though.... Keep an eye on that. You may want to add in extra glute work in the future.

 

[Sticky]

There are pro's and con's in general with both sitting back with shins vertical, or down with knees forward.

You need not worry yet, just keep it how it is mate.

 

[wingman]

There are pro's and con's in general with both sitting back with shins vertical, or down with knees forward.

You need not worry yet, just keep it how it is mate.

Which is generally better? I instinctively went down with knees forward when i had sneakers then when i invested in oly shoes i found i had to sit back with shins vertical to handle to same weight.

 

[nazzysmith]

There are pro's and con's in general with both sitting back with shins vertical, or down with knees forward.

You need not worry yet, just keep it how it is mate.

Hi Scott,

Do you have the time to list the main pros and cons?

Thanks!

 

[Sticky]

There is no "better" it comes down to the lifters strengths.

I believe shins vertical is better for the knees, but I definitely wouldn't be doing it in oly shoes.

 

[Sticky]

Knee forward
Cons (for PL)
Quad dominate squat
High bar positioning
Possible increase wear and tear on the knee due to extra flexion.

Pros
Quad dominate
Shortens knee-hip/hip-bar lever


Sitting back
Cons
Increases lever length

Pros
Better for knee
Low bar positioning
Utalise more of the back/glutes

There are more, but you get the just of it.

 

[Bazza20]

There is no "better" it comes down to the lifters strengths.

I believe shins vertical is better for the knees, but I definitely wouldn't be doing it in oly shoes.

For what ever retarded reason a shins vertical low bar type squat smashes my knees way more than an oly style squat.

 

[Zoot]

Yep...I reckon it would
BTW...That's a mean set of quads there Zoot...(a bit homo)

Wanted to swap: One set of quads in exchange for a decent squat or deadlift