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SEDDS Liquid Delivery System + NADS

El Stiffy said:
I read the two links and I've read that before:

(1) Increased Estrogen - easily controlled.
(2) Tamoxifen is a carcinogen - If this is true I don't know, but Tamoxifen is a totally different substance to Clomid.

Read it all before O.N. You just keep posting to advertise RES.
Click to expand...

If you want to comment on something you should really read it now and not base it on I've read that a long time ago: The Dangers of Clomid and Nolvadex | Wicked Supplements

Clomiphene (Clomid) consists of two stereoisomers which possess radically different pharmacodynamics. Zuclomiphene has predominantly estrogenic effects and slow clearance while the enclomiphene isomer has predominately anti-estrogenic effects and quick clearance. (9) This creates a dichotomy between estrogen blockage and estrogen stimulation and an acute imbalance once Clomid administration is discontinued. Bodybuilders will often complain of “estrogenic rebound” after stopping Clomid, which could be attributed to the lingering estrogenic isomer zuclomiphene as the anti-estrogenic enclomiphene has long cleared the system. (Recently, enclomiphene has been isolated by the pharmaceutical company Repros, for use in Androxal™.)
For all intents and purposes, tamoxifen is a superior SERM, simply for the fact that tamoxifen provides a purely anti-estrogenic isomer, whereas Clomid provides a mix of anti and pro estrogenic effects.
In regards to the health consequences about to be listed, it can be safely assumed that Clomid will share similar detrimental effects as tamoxifen, since it shares the same triphenylethylene backbone and carcinogenic tendencies. (44,45,57,58)


44. Biotransformation of the Antiestrogen Clomiphene to Chemically Reactive Metabolites in the Immature Female Rat
Peter C. Ruenitz, et. al
Cancer Res., Aug 1987; 47: 4015 – 4019.
45. Teratogenic effects of clomiphene, tamoxifen, and diethylstilbestrol on the developing human female genital tract.
GR Cunha, O Taguchi, R Namikawa, Y Nishizuka, and SJ Robboy
Hum Pathol, Nov 1987; 18(11): 1132-43.

57. Endometrial biopsy during induction of ovulation with clomiphene citrate in polycystic ovary syndrome.
R Homburg, H Pap, M Brandes, J Huirne, P Hompes, and CB Lambalk
Gynecol Endocrinol, September 1, 2006; 22(9): 506-10.
58. In vivo evaluation of the genotoxic effects of clomiphene citrate on rat reticulocytes: a micronucleus genotoxicity.
B Duran, I Ozdemir, Y Demirel, O Ozdemir, A Cetin, and A Guven
Gynecol Obstet Invest, Jan 2006; 61(4): 228-31.
 
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O.N. said:
If you want to comment on something you should really read it now and not base it on I've read that a long time ago
Click to expand...

Lol. I read all your stuff and I've been researching this for months, probably years passively.

Got anymore studies pls [MENTION=3627]Silverback[/MENTION]; loves studies.
 
Really sounds like you did your research and we should all start taking drugs based on your views with no science showing safety.
You dont have breast cancer SERM's are not for PCT or test boosters.

Genitourinary
Ovarian enlargement, ovarian hyperstimulation syndrome
Common (1% to 10%): Abnormal uterine bleeding (intermenstrual spotting, menorrhagia), multiple pregnancies, spontaneous abortions (ectopic pregnancies, hydatiform moles, fetus papyraceous)
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Stillbirths, increased urinary frequency/volume, vaginal dryness, priapism
Frequency not reported: Temporary sterility in males
Postmarketing reports: Endometriosis, ovarian cyst, ovarian hemorrhage, tubal pregnancy, uterine hemorrhage

Ocular
Common (1% to 10%): Blurred vision, lights, floaters, waves, unspecified visual complaints, photophobia, diplopia, scotomata, phosphenes
Frequency not reported: Scintillations, heat waves, irreversible palinopsia (prolonged afterimages), shimmering of the peripheral field
Postmarketing reports: Abnormal accommodation, cataract, eye pain, macular edema, optic neuritis, photopsia, posterior vitreous detachment, retinal hemorrhage, retinal thrombosis, retinal vascular spasm, temporary or prolonged loss of vision, possibly irreversible

Cardiovascular
Very common (10% or more): Vasomotor flushes
Postmarketing reports: Arrhythmias, chest pain, edema, hypertension, palpitations, phlebitis, pulmonary embolism, shortness of breath, tachycardia, thrombophlebitis.

Endocrine
Frequency not reported: Gynecomastia, thyroid disorders
Postmarketing reports: Thyroid disorders

Oncologic
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Leydig cell tumor of testis (in male treated for oligospermia)
Frequency not reported: Ovarian cancer, increased risk of borderline or invasive ovarian tumor
Postmarketing reports: Hepatic hemangiosarcoma, liver cell adenoma, hepatocellular carcinoma, fibrocystic disease, breast carcinoma, endometrial carcinoma, astrocytoma, pituitary tumor, prolactinoma, neurofibromatosis, glioblastoma multiforme, brain abscess, luteoma of pregnancy, dermoid cyst of the ovary, ovarian carcinoma, hydatiform mole, choriocarcinoma, melanoma, myeloma, perianal cysts, renal cell carcinoma, Hodgkin's lymphoma, tongue carcinoma, bladder carcinoma

Nervous system
Common (1% to 10%): Headache
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Dizziness, insomnia, light-headedness, nervous tension, vertigo
Postmarketing reports: Migraine headache, paresthesia, seizure, stroke, syncope

Dermatologic
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Dermatitis, rash, hair loss, dry hair
Frequency not reported: Reversible alopecia, urticaria, acne, erythema nodosum, erythema multiforme
Postmarketing reports: Acne, allergic reaction, erythema, erythema multiforme, erythema nodosum, hypertrichosis, pruritis, urticaria

Gastrointestinal
Common (1% to 10%): Abdominal-pelvic discomfort/distention/bloating, nausea, vomiting
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Acute abdomen, constipation, diarrhea

Hematologic
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Deep vein thrombosis
Frequency not reported: Pituitary hemorrhage (with undiagnosed pituitary tumor)
Postmarketing reports: Leukocytosis
A 32-year-old woman receiving clomiphene citrate treatment for ovulation induction was admitted for complaints of swelling and pain in her right calf. Her medical history was unremarkable except for complications following an appendectomy three years prior which resulted in a deep vein thrombosis (DVT) and subsequent pulmonary embolism. The patient had been taking clomiphene two days prior to the development of the first DVT. Six months later, the treatment with clomiphene was renewed. The patient developed recurrent DVT following repeated standard clomiphene treatment.

Hepatic
Postmarketing reports: Increased transaminases, hepatitis

Metabolic
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Increased appetite, weight gain/loss

Musculoskeletal
Postmarketing reports: Arthralgia, back pain, myalgia

Other
Common (1% to 10%): Breast discomfort
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Fatigue
Frequency not reported: Elevated levels of desmosterol (for prolonged therapy)
Postmarketing reports: Fever, tinnitus, weakness
Fetal/Neonatal Anomalies and Mortality:
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Congenital heart lesions, down syndrome, club foot, congenital gut lesions, hypospadias, microcephaly, harelip and cleft palate, congenital hip, hemangioma, undescended testicles, polydactyly, conjoined twins and teratomatous malformation, patent ductus arteriosus, amaurosis, arteriovenous fistula, inguinal hernia, umbilical hernia, syndactyly, pectus excavatum, myopathy, dermoid cyst of scalp, omphalocele, spina bifida occulta, ichthyosis, and persistent lingual frenulum, neonatal death, fetal death/stillbirth
Postmarketing reports: Skeletal malformations of the skull, face, nasal passages, jaw, hand, limb (ectromelia including amelia, hemimelia, and phocomelia), foot (clubfoot), spine, joints; septal heart defects, muscular ventricular septal defect, patent ductus arteriosus, tetralogy of Fallot, coarctation of the aorta; down syndrome; ear abnormalities and deafness; cleft lip and palate, imperforate anus, tracheoesophageal fistula, diaphragmatic hernia, omphalocele; hypospadias, cloacal exstrophy, lung tissue malformations; malformations of the eye and lens (cataract); neuroectodermal tumor, thyroid tumor, hepatoblastoma, lymphocytic leukemia; neural tube defects (anencephaly, meningomyelocele), microcephaly, hydrocephalus; renal agenesis and renal dysgenesis; dwarfism, mental retardation

Psychiatric
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Depression
Postmarketing reports: Anxiety, irritability, mood changes, psychosis

Respiratory
Uncommon (0.1% to 1%): Pulmonary embolism (in male treated for infertility)
 
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Holy shit [MENTION=10445]O.N.[/MENTION]; I hope I don't die before I post this. I also like the stuff about my Ovaries and my failed pregnancy.
 
El Stiffy said:
Holy shit @O.N. ; I hope I don't die before I post this. I also like the stuff about my Ovaries and my failed pregnancy.
Click to expand...

If you actually used your brain you would know that the male prostate shares the same embryonic line as the uterus.....males do not often participate in breast cancer drug studies so data is limited however rats of both sexes have and like female humans the same result was found in female rats with the uterus and male rats with the prostate.

Good luck with your health in the years to come.
 
The increased sex drive is a bitch though [MENTION=10445]O.N.[/MENTION]; I've got half a chubb even whilst talking to you, fucken sux. Feel like jacking off :(
 
O.N. said:
And the toxic effects......all the studies and references....you deny this?
Click to expand...

If this is true I don't know, but Tamoxifen, the drug you refer to, is a totally different substance to Clomid.

But Doctors do seem to see Clomid as a safe drug.
 
El Stiffy said:
If this is true I don't know, but Tamoxifen, the drug you refer to, is a totally different substance to Clomid.

But Doctors do seem to see Clomid as a safe drug.
Click to expand...

Ok so you tell people it's safe to take a drug which has clearly a load of scientific proof showing it to be toxic in many areas of the body.
 
I gotta go O.N. You continue to post though, the more studies the merrier I always say.

EVERYONE, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH!!!
 
Uterine cancer after use of clomiphene citrate to induce ovulation. - PubMed - NCBI

JAMA Network | JAMA Ophthalmology | Visual Disturbance Secondary to Clomiphene Citrate


Endogenous testosterone elevation from clomiphene stimulation raised PSA levels the highest, and testosterone patches yielded the least PSA response. Ten men underwent biopsy of the prostate. In one patient, a nodule was found on DRE; the other nine men underwent biopsy because of suspicious PSA levels. Of these patients, two were found to have adenocarcinoma (a form of cancer), and a third man who underwent rebiopsy was also found to have cancer. (Thats 4 out of 10 found to have prostate cancer) and the other 6 found to have high PSA levels which is not a good sign and will require follow ups.....anyone who doesn't know PSA is prostate specific antigen, it is one of the first things tested when looking for prostate cancer....high levels indicate abnormalities within the prostate.


exactly the more studies the merrier start here:
(Anyone actually concerned about taking clomid or nolva copy the below reference 1 by 1 into google and look for the related journal)
The write up related to these reference is here: The Dangers of Clomid and Nolvadex

References -
1. Drug Discovery
By Walter Sneader
2. D.E.S., the bitter pill.
Meyers, Robert (1983).
New York: Seaview/Putnam. ISBN 0-399-31008-8
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VC Jordan, B Haldemann, and KE Allen
Endocrinology, Apr 1981; 108: 1353.
4. Antioestrogens: a review.
LUNAN, C.B. et al.
Clin. Endocrinol., 4, 551–572. (1975).
5. Patient No More: The Politics of Breast Cancer,
Batt, Sharon et al
Spinifex Press, Melbourne, Australia, 1994, page 118
6. The Estrogen Receptor: A model for molecular medicine
Elwood V et al.
Department of Cell Biology. Vol 9, 1980-1989
7. Tamoxifen (ICI46,474) as a targeted therapy to treat and prevent breast cancer
V Craig Jordan
British Journal of Pharmacology (2006) 147, S269-S276
8. Selective estrogen receptor modulation: concept and consequences in cancer.
VC Jordan
Cancer Cell, March 1, 2004; 5(3): 207-13.
9. A pharmacological review of selective oestrogen receptor modulators
Steven R. Goldstein, Suresh Siddhanti, Angelina V. Ciaccia, and Leo Plouffe, Jr
Hum. Reprod. Update, May 2000; 6: 212 – 224.
10. Clomiphene citrate (Clomid).
The Wm. S. Merrell Company
Clin. Pharmacol. Therap., 8: 891–897, 1967.
11. Cole, M. P., Jones, C. T., and Todd, I. D. A new anti-oestrogenic
agent in late breast cancer. An early clinical appraisal of ICI46474. Br. J.
Cancer, 25: 270–275, 1971.
12. Ward, H. W. Anti-oestrogen therapy for breast cancer: a trial of
tamoxifen at two dose levels. Br. Med. J., 1: 13–14, 1973.
13. Breast Cancer? Breast Health!
Weed, Susan S.,
Ash Tree Publishing, Woodstock, New York, 1996, page 203
14. High-dose tamoxfen in the treatment of inoperable hepatocellular carcinoma: A multiicenter randomized controlled trial.
Chow et al.
Hepatology, 36: 1221-1226, 2002
15. Liver Cancer: New Research
By Felix Lee
Publisher: Nova (2006)
16. IARC Tamoxifen: Monographs on the evaluation of carcinogenic risks to humans.
66: 253-365, 1996
17. Eye problems in breast cancer patients treated with tamoxifen
Paganini Hill et al.
Breast Cancer Res Treat, 60: 167-172 2000
18. Ovarian hyperstimulation and oophorectomy following accidental daily clomiphene citrate use over three consecutive months.
ES Sills, EA Poynor, and M Moomjy
Reprod Toxicol, Nov 2000; 14(6): 541-3.
19. Uterine Cancer after Use of Clomiphene Citrate to Induce Ovulation
Michelle D. et al
Am. J. Epidemiol., Apr 2005; 161: 607 – 615
20. Detoxifying Cancer Causing Agents to Prevent Cancer
Margaret Hanausek, Zbigniew Walaszek, and Thomas J. Slaga Integr
Cancer Ther, Jun 2003; 2: 139 – 144.
21. Understanding the genotoxicity of tamoxifen?
David H. Phillips
Carcinogenesis, Jun 2001; 22: 839 – 849.
22. A randomized clinical trial evaluating tamoxifen in the treatment of patients with node-negative breast cancer who have estrogen-receptor-positive tumors
B Fisher, et al.
N. Engl. J. Med., Feb 1989; 320: 479 – 484
23. Tamoxifen treatment and its consequences
Adrian Shulman, Ilan Cohen, Ron Maymon, and Marco M. Altaras
Hum. Reprod., Aug 1995; 10: 2174 – 2175
24. Tamoxifen induced hepatotoxicity in breast cancer patients with pre-existing liver steatosis: the role of glucose intolerance.
Elefsiniotis et al.
European Journal of Gastroenterology and Hepatology 2004;16:593-598.
25. Incidence and risk factors for non-alcoholic steatohepatitis: prospective study of 5408 women enrolled in Italian tamoxifen chemoprevention trial
Savino Bruno el al.
BMJ 2005;330;932-; originally published online 3 Mar 2005;
26. Fatty liver and transaminase changes with adjuvant tamoxifen therapy.
Liu, Chien-Liang a c; Huang, Jon-Kway b; Cheng, Shih-Ping a
Anti-Cancer Drugs. 17(6):709-713, July 2006
27. The association between tamoxifen and the development of hepatocellular carcinoma: case report and literature review.
Law CH, Tandan VR.
Can J Surg 1999;42:211-4.
28. Hepatocellular carcinoma after long-term tamoxifen therapy
D. F. Moffat, K. A. Oien, J. Dickson, T. Habeshaw and D. R. McLellan
Volume 11, Number 9 / September, 2000
29. Tamoxifen-associated hepatocellular damage and agranulocytosis.
Ching,C.K., Smith,P.G. and Long,R.G. (1992)
Lancet, 339, 940.
30. Tamoxifen induces hepatocellular carcinoma in rat liver: a 1-year study with two antiestrogens.
Hirsimaki P, Hirsimaki Y, Nieminen L, et al.
Arch Toxicol. 1993; 67: 49–4
31. Epigenetic reprogramming of liver cells in tamoxifen-induced rat hepatocarcinogenesis.
VP Tryndyak, O Kovalchuk, L Muskhelishvili, B Montgomery, R Rodriguez-Juarez, S Melnyk, SA Ross, FA Beland, and IP Pogribny
Mol Carcinog, Mar 2007; 46(3): 187-97
32. Antiestrogens and the formation of DNA damage in rats: a comparison.
Kim SY, Suzuki N, Laxmi YR, Umemoto A, Matsuda T, Shibutani S.
Chem Res Toxicol. 2006 Jun;19(6):852-8.
33. Activation of 4-hydroxytamoxifen and the tamoxifen derivative metabolite E by uterine peroxidase to form DNA adducts: Comparison with DNA adducts formed in the uterus of Sprague-Dawley rats treated with tamoxifen
Deena N. Pathak, Krisztina Pongracz, and William J. Bodell
Carcinogenesis, Sep 1996; 17: 1785 – 1790
34. Activation of the Tamoxifen Derivative Metabolite E to Form DNA Adducts: Comparison with the Adducts Formed by Microsomal Activation of Tamoxifen
Krisztina Pongracz, Deena N. Pathak, Takemichi Nakamura, Alma L. Burlingame, and William J. Bodell
Cancer Res., Jul 1995; 55: 3012 – 3015.
35. Activation of tamoxifen and its metabolite -hydroxytamoxifen to DNA-binding products: comparisons between human, rat and mouse hepatocytes.
Phillips,D.H., Carmichael,P.L., Hewer,A., Cole,K.J., Hardcastle,I.R., Poon,G.K., Keogh,A. and Strain,A.J.
Carcinogenesis, 17, 88–94. (1996)
36. Adjuvant tamoxifen in early breast cancer: occurrence of new primary cancers.
Fornander,T., Rutquist,L.E., Cedermark,B., Glas,U., Mattsson,A., Silfversward,C., Skoog,L., Somell,A., Theve,T., Wilking,N., Askergren,J. and Hjalmar,M.-L.
Lancet, i, 117–120.(1989)
37. Reduced genotoxicity of [D5-ethyl]-tamoxifen implicates -hydroxylation of the ethyl group as a major pathway of tamoxifen activation to a liver carcinogen.
Phillips,D.H., Potter,G.A., Horton,M.N., Hewer,A., Crofton-Sleigh,C., Jarman,M. and Venitt,S. (1994)
Carcinogenesis, 15, 1487–1492
38. Genotoxicity of tamoxifen, tamoxifen epoxide and toremifene in human lymphoblastoid cells containing human cytochrome P450s.
Styles,J.A., et al (1994)
Carcinogenesis, 15, 5–9.
39. Clastogenic and aneugenic effects of tamoxifen and some of its analogues in hepatocytes from dosed rats and in human lymphoblastoid cells transfected with human P450 cDNAs (MCL-5 cells).
Styles,J.A., et al. (1997)
Carcinogenesis, 18, 303–313.
40. Effect of tamoxifen on endometrial proliferation
A Decensi, et al.
J. Clin. Oncol., Feb 1996; 14: 434 – 440.
41. Safety Testing of New Drugs. Tamoxifen.
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Academic Press, London, pp. 125–161. (1984)
42. Endometrial cancer in tamoxifen-treated breast cancer patients: findings from the National Surgical Adjuvant Breast and Bowel Project (NSABP) B-14.
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J. Natl Cancer Inst., 86, 527–537.
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JH Glick, A Wein, K Padavic, W Negendank, D Harris, and H Brodovsky
Cancer, Apr 1982; 49(7): 1367-72.
44. Biotransformation of the Antiestrogen Clomiphene to Chemically Reactive Metabolites in the Immature Female Rat
Peter C. Ruenitz, et. al
Cancer Res., Aug 1987; 47: 4015 – 4019.
45. Teratogenic effects of clomiphene, tamoxifen, and diethylstilbestrol on the developing human female genital tract.
GR Cunha, O Taguchi, R Namikawa, Y Nishizuka, and SJ Robboy
Hum Pathol, Nov 1987; 18(11): 1132-43.
46. Tamoxifen-associated eye disease. A review
SG Nayfield and MB Gorin
J. Clin. Oncol., Mar 1996; 14: 1018 – 1026.
47. Tamoxifen administration is associated with a high rate of treatment-limiting symptoms in male breast cancer patients.
Anelli TF, et al.
Department of Surgery, Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center, New York, New York 10021.
48. DNA adducts caused by tamoxifen and toremifene in human microsomal system and lymphocytes in vitro.
Hemminki,K., Widlak,P. and Hou,S.-M. (1995)
Carcinogenesis, 16, 1661–1664.
49. Major difference in the hepatocarcinogenicity and DNA adduct forming ability between toremifene and tamoxifen in female Crl:CD(BR) rats.
GC Hard, et al.
Cancer Res., Oct 1993; 53(19): 4534-41.
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D Thiebaud and RJ Secrest
Reprod Fertil Dev, January 1, 2001; 13(4): 331-6.
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RL Shazer, et al.
BJU Int, Apr 2006; 97(4): 691-7.
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M Heringa
Int J Clin Pharmacol Ther, August 1, 2003; 41(8): 331-45.
53. Comparison of effects of the rise in serum testosterone by raloxifene and oral testosterone on serum insulin-like growth factor-1 and insulin-like growth factor binding protein-3.
EJ Duschek, et al
Maturitas, July 16, 2005; 51(3): 286-93.
54. Effects of tamoxifen on steroid hormone receptors and hormone concentration and the results of DNA analysis by flow cytometry in endometrial carcinoma.
M Nola, et al
Gynecol Oncol, Mar 1999; 72(3): 331-6.
55. Tamoxifen increases the plasma estrogen-binding equivalents and has an estradiol agonistic effect on histologically normal premenopausal and postmenopausal
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endometrium. Fertil. Steril, 57, 320-327. (1992)
56. Estrogen and progesterone receptor expressors o£ decidual endometrium in a postmenopausal woman treated with tamoxifen and megestrol acetate.
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Gynecol. Obstet. Invest., 38, 127-129. (1994)
57. Endometrial biopsy during induction of ovulation with clomiphene citrate in polycystic ovary syndrome.
R Homburg, H Pap, M Brandes, J Huirne, P Hompes, and CB Lambalk
Gynecol Endocrinol, September 1, 2006; 22(9): 506-10.
58. In vivo evaluation of the genotoxic effects of clomiphene citrate on rat reticulocytes: a micronucleus genotoxicity.
B Duran, I Ozdemir, Y Demirel, O Ozdemir, A Cetin, and A Guven
Gynecol Obstet Invest, Jan 2006; 61(4): 228-31.
59. Clomiphene citrate – end of an era? a mini-review
Roy Homburg
Hum. Reprod., Aug 2005; 20: 2043 – 2051
60. Selective estrogen receptor modulators: pharmacological profile in the rat uterus.
Bryant H. U., Wilson P. K., Adrian M. D., Cole H. W., Phillips D. L., Dodge J. A., Grese T. A., Sluka J. P., Glasebrook A. L.
J. Soc. Gynecol. Invest., 3: 152A 1996.
61. Molecular perspectives on selective estrogen receptor modulators (SERMs): progress in understanding their tissue-specific agonist and antagonist actions.
Lonard D. M., Smith C. L.
Steroid, 67: 15-24, 2002
62. Defining the “S” in SERMS.
Katznellenbogen B. S., Katznellenbogen J. A.
Science (Wash. DC), 295: 2380-2381, 2002
 
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Thanks for the concern [MENTION=10445]O.N.[/MENTION]; albeit a financial investment in your own product I assume.
[MENTION=895]Shrek[/MENTION]; gave me a digital prostate examination last weekend, all good he said!
 
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