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Bali 9 Duo

[MENTION=2727]Fadi[/MENTION]; can you just clear this up please, you don't defend or condone what ISIS has or is doing?
 
Sir El Stiffy said:
@Fadi ; can you just clear this up please, you don't defend or condone what ISIS has or is doing?
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Like Adrian said, if you would like to discuss IS, then a new IS thread would be in order. You're welcome to start it if you wish Sir, and I'll be happy to answer any of your question on the subject.

Edit: Ah, I just noticed you've already started such a thread. And I also noticed that I don't particularly wish to be part of it based on what I saw there already. I'm really not interested in having arguments with people over anything. Sorry about that.
 
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Judging by the other thread, [MENTION=2727]Fadi[/MENTION]; is smart not to be part of it

You sure did get out of the wrong side of the bed today [MENTION=6722]Bazza20[/MENTION];
 

I've got to say Fadi, I am disappointed. In another thread you kept on defending ISIS and even now you keep taking a one sided view.

My views on true Islam have changed abit just with your non-denouncement of ISIS and your defending ISIS in the other thread. I hope people are wrong and that Muslims are not anti everyone else who isn't a Muslim as ISIS and their ilk seems to be.

If you are against what ISIS are doing, it is quite simple to just denounce it but still defend Islam as a religion.
 
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Sir El Stiffy said:
I've got to say Fadi, I am disappointed. In another thread you kept on defending ISIS and even now you keep taking a one sided view.
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I very much agree with what Repacked is saying below.

Repacked said:
I have yet to see a statement of support for ISIS or their actions from anyone on this forum.
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You seem to hold a different opinion from what this gentleman is stating. Perhaps you would like to expose my support for ISIS, and while you're at it, explain my one sided view to everyone here. You've got me all intrigued about my own self now. I can't wait to see how I kept on defending ISIS!

My views on true Islam have changed a bit just with your non-denouncement of ISIS and your defending ISIS in the other thread.
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What do you know about true Islam Sir? If I recall correctly, you yourself have said that you have read the whole bible but have not read the Qur'an. And as far as denouncing ISIS, I'd much rather deal with some REAL issues here and not waste my time with superficialities. If you break your leg, you would find it insulting of me to run like a maniac in order to find a Band-Aid to place on your leg to fix the problem, would you not? Here we have a situation that requires some serious attention from a qualified doctor, yet all you see me focusing on is placing that strip of Band-Aid onto your broken leg. I think I’ve made my point.

I know you're a clever man when you choose to be, but just in case you still don't get my drift, I'm simply saying I'd much rather deal with the cause instead of its symptom. As most of us today (unfortunately) have become accustomed to doing and accepting as a normal and rational behaviour.

I hope people are wrong and that Muslims are not anti everyone else who isn't a Muslim as ISIS and their ilk seems to be.
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Rest assured, Muslims are not anti-non-Muslims. If you ask them, some would tell you it's the other way around, based on what they constantly hear or read in the mainstream media.

If you are against what ISIS are doing, it is quite simple to just denounce it but still defend Islam as a religion.
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Islam is in no need of my defending, you can trust me on that. Despite all the negativity this faith has been receiving in the mainstream media, its light is still shining brightly. Distinguishing the light of Islam is on the agenda of many, and it has been the goal since day one, without success.You say it's quite simple to denounce ISIS. Okay, so I denounce ISIS, would that make you happy? Would you now allow yourself to trust me? And if I don't denounce ISIS, would that make me a terrorist by default? Would you not rather have a deep and meaningful conversation, one that may lead to a better understanding of the situation at hand, and one that perhaps can bring us both closer to the truth?

Getting back on the issue of denouncement, allow me to say this to you Sir; when you ask Muslims to condemn or denounce monstrous actions, ideologies or groups, what you’re in fact saying is that you don’t trust any Muslim. Because you’re saying that I can’t be trusted until and unless I voice my disagreement and opposition against an individual, an action, an ideology or a group that claims to do something in the name of a shared identity.

Do white people need to speak out so as to not come off as being racists when one of them calls a black man a ******? Would I have the right to demand of all white people a loud and vocal denouncement of racism, lest I otherwise accuse them all of being rednecks. Do Christians have to prove themselves to me when one who shares their identity goes into an abortion clinic and blows the doctor’s brains out? Do Jewish people have to denounce the heinous crime committed by Baruch Kappel Goldstein when he mowed down dozens of Muslim worshipers with an automatic rifle as they knelt in dawn prayer at a mosque? No, the answer is no they don’t have to.

So I ask you to please not confuse silence with consent, if you do, you would be seen as desperately looking for a scapegoat to hate, especially after I have offered you a full and meaningful opportunity for a discussion on this whole issue if you’re at all interested.

Finally and in closing, I say: I know why the Islamic State was born, and I know its purpose and aspirations. I however do not agree with its methods, as I am certain there are better ways, (especially today in our age of technology), to achieve the same goal, without the shedding of a single drop of blood.
 
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Thank you [MENTION=2727]Fadi[/MENTION]; It felt to me you were skirting the issue of denouncing ISIS's deplorable acts by posting about a possible fake video without coming out and condemning ISIS's brutality. That's the concern I had. I have heard Muslims groups being criticized in the media for not condemning ISIS and I did begin to wonder if perhaps there is something going on there where although Muslims are a peace and loving people they won't speak out against ISIS.

I thank you again for posting that as I feel your post is a great "ambassador" for Muslim and non-Muslim peoples relations in a time when that relationship is a bit strained by ISIS's actions.
 
First we have this: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...r-bali-nine-prison-costs-20150312-141pts.html

Australia is offering to pay the costs of Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran's life imprisonment if Indonesia shows mercy and spares the lives of the reformed drug traffickers.

I do not agree with the above and believe Australia ought to respect Indonesia's court decision and move on. Spending the money here on educating our youngsters at school and through TV advertisement that it's not cool to be involved with drugs would be tax payers' money better spent, (in my opinion).

And just when I thought things could not get worse, we now have this: http://www.smh.com.au/world/bali-ni...ew-chan-myuran-sukumaran-20150311-141jib.html

Australia's most senior Muslim cleric pleads for lives of Andrew Chan, Myuran Sukumaran. "On behalf of the Islamic community of Australia, we plead, with respect and humility, for mercy for the lives of two young Australian men, who have not only shown repentance for their serious crimes, but have rehabilitated themselves and indeed others," Dr Abu Mohamed said in a statement.

By the way doctor, there is no such thing as an "Islamic community", there is however a Muslim community.

Then he goes on to say: "....we note that mercy and forgiveness lies at the heart of Islam for those who repent and have reformed their ways. We urge that the heritage of mercy in our religion is fully and deeply considered in the application of state law."

Yes doctor, but with all due respect sir, Islam is also a "religion" of justice and strict impartiality and is 100% devoid of any sense of nationalism! Meaning, that Islam does not just fight for your right because you are an Australian, or because you are the son of a wealthy man, or any of those attributes that could be used to influence the final judgment, but Islam fights for you to see that justice takes precedence above all else irrespective of nationality, colour , or creed...., period! That is the true Islam, minus the PR bull****...., sir!
 
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Surprised the Indo's didn't take the money off us. They're good at that.
I reckon if they want help from Australia, we don't send money. We send produce that's made here, so money stays in Australia, but we meet our foreign aid requirements. Send cattle, sheep, fruit, wheat etc at the same value as the cash we send. Just my 2c. And maybe I need to stop listening to AM radio during the day! Lol
 
Very underhandedly they are charging aussies for visas now whereas most other countries are able to get a free pass in. So they are still taking money off us (the touristy folks that is!)
 
They've always charged for a visa on arrival, it's nothing new. It has gone up to $35 US from $25 but they have included the departure tax in your ticket now rather than paying it on leaving, so it works out about the same.

Japan, China, South Korea and Russians get in free as its a similar policy in their country. We charge to come in here, so they're going to charge us.

I'm going to Turkey next month, $60 US to get an Aussie in the door. Free for kiwi's, work that one out.
 
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taurus said:
Surprised the Indo's didn't take the money off us. They're good at that.
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I wish they didn't accept a single cent from Australia, especially when we have a PM like the current one. The man obviously does not understand Indonesian's culture and way of thinking. Making more enemies with the average Indonesian every time he opens his mouth re the two convicted drug offenders doesn't help our relationship with that country. And I'm mainly interested with the average man and woman on the street and not necessarily the Indonesian government here. Of course, I'm referring to that shameful tsunami aid reciprocation comment he made, of which our foreign minister Julie Bishop had to concede that it was seen as "unhelpful" by Indonesia. What's next I wonder?!
 
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