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About becoming a personal trainer
- Thread starter Kyle Aaron
- Start date
Kyle. Yeah mate i think your putting your foot in the right door, just because those people are using that type of equipment doesnt mean your working in a bad place, maby just not strength orientated like you might like. Not everyone will enjoy squatting with a bar on their back and thats up to them after all, all we can do as trainers is work around their likes and dislikes 
i still think your going about it the right way, word of mouth is an awesome way to land a job, or even just to get a resume and good word in over the top of others... sounds evil to almost grass cut people but hey, its life i suppose 
Hyjak, Mate colleges are so much more expensive, my cert 3&4 courses combined cost me 4250, im pushed for time much like yourself and at the time i was prepared to pay that just so i could get it out of the way quickly. ill have my full acreditation out of the way within 6 months rather than 1 year and a half, I probably could have finished it sooner if they didnt need all answers 100% lol... but anywho... I know the tafe where my missus studied cert 3&4 set her back about a grand but as i said, it took her a year and a half. I must say she has managed to retain a fair bit of information but then again since im constantly reading up on my books to make sure i pass this course, im keeping up
i still think your going about it the right way, word of mouth is an awesome way to land a job, or even just to get a resume and good word in over the top of others... sounds evil to almost grass cut people but hey, its life i suppose Hyjak, Mate colleges are so much more expensive, my cert 3&4 courses combined cost me 4250, im pushed for time much like yourself and at the time i was prepared to pay that just so i could get it out of the way quickly. ill have my full acreditation out of the way within 6 months rather than 1 year and a half, I probably could have finished it sooner if they didnt need all answers 100% lol... but anywho... I know the tafe where my missus studied cert 3&4 set her back about a grand but as i said, it took her a year and a half. I must say she has managed to retain a fair bit of information but then again since im constantly reading up on my books to make sure i pass this course, im keeping up
Kyle Aaron
Active member
Jman, I have no objection to people not squatting with a bar on their back. They can instead leg press, do dumbbell sumo squats, or even begin with a simple bodyweight squat. Those are all fine. Some are better for some people, but all those are fine.
All that matters is that they get their bodies moving and progress the effort, whether by increasing the weights, reps and sets, or increasing the range of motion or progressing the exercise itself, eg from knee pressups to pressups.
For example, one young woman the other day I had to write a routine for, she said she hated free weights. So, leg press, lat pulldown, machine chest press, and a few others for fluff. Doesn't worry me. It's a pity, since she was certainly physically capable of dumbbell and barbell exercises, but she didn't want to, so there you go. So long as she adds reps and weight from time to time, she'll still be better off than she would just walking for miles on a treadmill reading Woman's Day.
What annoys me is when I see pointless exercises, or exercises which are dangerous and offer only a small benefit, like the guy kneeling on the swiss ball doing overhead presses with 3kg dumbbells - which I saw another one of yesterday.
The young woman I showed how to squat and deadlift yesterday had been doing fixed barbell half-squats with 15kg for 15 reps... for two months. She did not progress the range of motion, nor the reps and sets; so I had to progress her on the kind of exercise she was doing. Even if she spends the next two months doing a below parallel barbell squat of 40kg for several reps, she has progressed in range of motion, weight and difficulty. Then in two months she can progress again.
All the dangerous but with little benefit exercises, the rehab for healthy people, the months at the same weight and reps, those are simply wasted effort. The people coming to our gyms set aside their time and put in a lot of work. Some don't want to progress, some refuse to listen. I get told to piss off by someone every day - not in those words, but you know what they mean. One woman was doing half-squats with the bar, but she never removes her iPod, won't meet anyone's eye, when I wave and smile she looks down and hurries on - okay, she doesn't want help or a chat, I leave her alone.
But many absolutely do want to progress, and are interested in learning about their bodies and exercises. As trainers and coaches, we owe it to those people to give them the encouragement and information they need and want.
That's what they're paying for. Equipment? Bah, with a typical year's gym membership they could get all the equipment they need. They're paying for the atmosphere - lots of people working out - and the instruction. When trainers hang around near the desk saying, "yeah, he's useless, he'll always be like that," they are denying the person instruction. They're not earning their money. And that pisses me off.
It's not like we have a really hard job most of the time. All we do is talk to people about a subject we love.
All that matters is that they get their bodies moving and progress the effort, whether by increasing the weights, reps and sets, or increasing the range of motion or progressing the exercise itself, eg from knee pressups to pressups.
For example, one young woman the other day I had to write a routine for, she said she hated free weights. So, leg press, lat pulldown, machine chest press, and a few others for fluff. Doesn't worry me. It's a pity, since she was certainly physically capable of dumbbell and barbell exercises, but she didn't want to, so there you go. So long as she adds reps and weight from time to time, she'll still be better off than she would just walking for miles on a treadmill reading Woman's Day.
What annoys me is when I see pointless exercises, or exercises which are dangerous and offer only a small benefit, like the guy kneeling on the swiss ball doing overhead presses with 3kg dumbbells - which I saw another one of yesterday.
The young woman I showed how to squat and deadlift yesterday had been doing fixed barbell half-squats with 15kg for 15 reps... for two months. She did not progress the range of motion, nor the reps and sets; so I had to progress her on the kind of exercise she was doing. Even if she spends the next two months doing a below parallel barbell squat of 40kg for several reps, she has progressed in range of motion, weight and difficulty. Then in two months she can progress again.
All the dangerous but with little benefit exercises, the rehab for healthy people, the months at the same weight and reps, those are simply wasted effort. The people coming to our gyms set aside their time and put in a lot of work. Some don't want to progress, some refuse to listen. I get told to piss off by someone every day - not in those words, but you know what they mean. One woman was doing half-squats with the bar, but she never removes her iPod, won't meet anyone's eye, when I wave and smile she looks down and hurries on - okay, she doesn't want help or a chat, I leave her alone.
But many absolutely do want to progress, and are interested in learning about their bodies and exercises. As trainers and coaches, we owe it to those people to give them the encouragement and information they need and want.
That's what they're paying for. Equipment? Bah, with a typical year's gym membership they could get all the equipment they need. They're paying for the atmosphere - lots of people working out - and the instruction. When trainers hang around near the desk saying, "yeah, he's useless, he'll always be like that," they are denying the person instruction. They're not earning their money. And that pisses me off.
It's not like we have a really hard job most of the time. All we do is talk to people about a subject we love.
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Kyle Aaron
Active member
Today I saw a guy squatting pretty damn well. I went and told him so, turns out he's been training himself. He wants to be stronger, and to lose a bit of belly. I told him, "strength is built in the gym, size at the dinner table."
"Yeah I had heard that."
He had pretty much the right idea with his routine, it just needed clearing away the fluff, all he really knew about was squatting. I gave him a routine some here may find familiar, a simple "squat, deadlift, overhead press, then the next day squat, row, bench press, start with 2 warmup and 2 work sets of 5 reps, in every session do more."
He wanted to get bigger, I told him to drink milk.
I actually approached him not only because he was squatting well, but because he was wearing daggy shorts, loose t-shirt, and... a head sweatband. On his routine card I wrote "startingstrength.com" and "70sbig.com", when I showed him the sites he loved it.
"Yeah I had heard that."
He had pretty much the right idea with his routine, it just needed clearing away the fluff, all he really knew about was squatting. I gave him a routine some here may find familiar, a simple "squat, deadlift, overhead press, then the next day squat, row, bench press, start with 2 warmup and 2 work sets of 5 reps, in every session do more."
He wanted to get bigger, I told him to drink milk.
I actually approached him not only because he was squatting well, but because he was wearing daggy shorts, loose t-shirt, and... a head sweatband. On his routine card I wrote "startingstrength.com" and "70sbig.com", when I showed him the sites he loved it.
IRON TANKS
Site Advertiser
Just read this thread, well done Kyle for making the move. I also did my cert 3 and 4 at Holmesglen (all the way back in 2003). I was also working as a Chef part time while studying. I actually did both for a bit in 2007 while completing my degree in exercise science.
After working in both fields for years, there are definitely comparisons. I enjoyed both. Working as a chef is definitely taxing on the body. I enjoyed (well?) doing my 10-12 hour stint, going home and not worrying about anything.
You do less hours (generally) with PT, but it is more mentally fatiguing (particularly if you want to be a good coach/trainer/mentor).
I wouldn't say the hours are more conventional. Even for myself, who has a studio located 20 meters away from where I sit, it is a pain in the ass on some days. There are perks to it, but it has worn thin over the last year and a bit. I ran a group training session locally, that's a 5am start - I may have a few other appointments.. then I might have a final one at 8.30pm. Sure, i've got time to do stuff during the day - but your evenings are rortered.
I do have a few students who like to train during the day, which I do prefer.
Either way, you need to give it a go!
After working in both fields for years, there are definitely comparisons. I enjoyed both. Working as a chef is definitely taxing on the body. I enjoyed (well?) doing my 10-12 hour stint, going home and not worrying about anything.
You do less hours (generally) with PT, but it is more mentally fatiguing (particularly if you want to be a good coach/trainer/mentor).
I wouldn't say the hours are more conventional. Even for myself, who has a studio located 20 meters away from where I sit, it is a pain in the ass on some days. There are perks to it, but it has worn thin over the last year and a bit. I ran a group training session locally, that's a 5am start - I may have a few other appointments.. then I might have a final one at 8.30pm. Sure, i've got time to do stuff during the day - but your evenings are rortered.
I do have a few students who like to train during the day, which I do prefer.
Either way, you need to give it a go!
haz
Member
might find this interesting
whats wrong with the personal training industry?
an interview with JC Santana
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whats wrong with the personal training industry?
an interview with JC Santana
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haz
Member
i think that he's trying to say that the industry itself has no real heart or structure. that any trainer can be sold a new idea. there's not much evidence based practice going on either.
i liked the thought on how there are no role models and how a trainer doesn't have a concrete identity, which may be the cause of the high turn over.
i liked the thought on how there are no role models and how a trainer doesn't have a concrete identity, which may be the cause of the high turn over.
Kyle Aaron
Active member
There are lots of role models for trainers. I dunno, I think my identity is pretty strong. Perhaps it's an age thing, too. A 19 year old, it's a bit different to a 39 year old.
Any trainer without a clue can be sold a new idea. Evidence based practise should be the norm.
The industry itself has a structure that fits the demand - uninformed and in large part lazy clientele.
As far as role models go, I would list defranco, wendler, australias own markos, thib from t nation, rippetoe, tate... and those are just the top of my head and from my own narrow readings.
As with any industry if you don't 'check your sources' and have no direction or desire you will end up on your ass.
haz
Member
many sucessful trainers change the way they do things. they evolve.
all those guys aren't personal trainers for the most part. and they give little advice on general population training and dont talk about being a personal trainer at all.
it is much more common in the fitness industry.
What I wrote in no way suggests they don't or that it is a bad thing. If something works, by all means use it. That is the essence of evidence based practise: make sure it works!
They are all coaches who have worked with the general population and still do so, and most if not all have worked with people up to the advanced/elite level in addition to running their own successful business.
This is (probably) due to entry to the industry requiring less than six months study. Easier entry = more people who are not necessarily passionate or driven.
Kyle Aaron
Active member
The division between coach and trainer, like that between bodybuilding and strength training, is essentially an artificial one, set up so that one group can say, "me smart, you poopyhead." There's a difference in focus in what they do, certainly, and they've different sorts of clients; but different coaches have different focuses and clients, and different PTs have different focuses and clients, too.
If trainer Kyle takes a young woman and get her to do a low-bar squat, a deadlift and overhead press, and finish it off with a 20 rep dumbbell sumo squat... which is pretty much the sort of thing coach Markos and coach Rippetoe would do... and another trainer would take the same young woman and have her kneel on a swiss ball and do overhead presses with 3kg dumbbellls... and her goal is to increase strength... is PT Kyle really more similar to another trainer than he is to Markos or Rippetoe? What's more important, the philosophy of training, or the individual?
Do we just say, "well, Kyle's just learned a lot from coaches"? How about the Army influence on him, another kind of training again? Maybe Kyle's identity goes beyond his job title. Same as everyone else.
The differences between individuals and their approaches are far greater than the differences between "trainers" and "coaches". Thus, a PT may have some coach as a role model, and a coach some PT.
I think really that the guy ranting in the youtube/radio interview above was confusing his own disillusionment with a general problem in the industry. It's like when a guy gets dumped by his girlfriend and he decides that all women are bitches. They're not, he's just had a hard go of things.
Certainly there are many problems in the fitness industry. PTs having no role models or history ain't one of them. All the successful ones have a strong sense of identity, and many role models, people they look up to and respect.
A lack of direction etc is common in the fitness industry for the same reason it's common in hospitality, etc - it's relatively easy to get into. So drifters will drift in... but they'll drift out again. Remember what I said about the people who enter these courses, there are the Injured (people in physical rehab who got an interested in their bodies), the Sports/Martial Artist, the Aimless and the Passionate.
The Aimless are not going to just drift into the police force or a medical degree, because those things are hard to get into. They'll drift into retail, hospitality - or fitness. But they never stay. As I noted above, one of them I know is just 20 multiple choice questions short of getting her Cert IV, and half a year on hasn't done it yet. Aimless.
If trainer Kyle takes a young woman and get her to do a low-bar squat, a deadlift and overhead press, and finish it off with a 20 rep dumbbell sumo squat... which is pretty much the sort of thing coach Markos and coach Rippetoe would do... and another trainer would take the same young woman and have her kneel on a swiss ball and do overhead presses with 3kg dumbbellls... and her goal is to increase strength... is PT Kyle really more similar to another trainer than he is to Markos or Rippetoe? What's more important, the philosophy of training, or the individual?
Do we just say, "well, Kyle's just learned a lot from coaches"? How about the Army influence on him, another kind of training again? Maybe Kyle's identity goes beyond his job title. Same as everyone else.
The differences between individuals and their approaches are far greater than the differences between "trainers" and "coaches". Thus, a PT may have some coach as a role model, and a coach some PT.
I think really that the guy ranting in the youtube/radio interview above was confusing his own disillusionment with a general problem in the industry. It's like when a guy gets dumped by his girlfriend and he decides that all women are bitches. They're not, he's just had a hard go of things.
Certainly there are many problems in the fitness industry. PTs having no role models or history ain't one of them. All the successful ones have a strong sense of identity, and many role models, people they look up to and respect.
A lack of direction etc is common in the fitness industry for the same reason it's common in hospitality, etc - it's relatively easy to get into. So drifters will drift in... but they'll drift out again. Remember what I said about the people who enter these courses, there are the Injured (people in physical rehab who got an interested in their bodies), the Sports/Martial Artist, the Aimless and the Passionate.
The Aimless are not going to just drift into the police force or a medical degree, because those things are hard to get into. They'll drift into retail, hospitality - or fitness. But they never stay. As I noted above, one of them I know is just 20 multiple choice questions short of getting her Cert IV, and half a year on hasn't done it yet. Aimless.
haz
Member
there is a bit of a difference between coaches and personal trainers imo. for the most part trainers work in a general population gym where clients are assigned to them or they meet them on the floor, and the session is usually one on one.
a coach will generally not do one on one sessions, the client usually seeks them out for a reason (improve sport, strength, body comp) so therefore the client has aligned themselves with you before you had to say a word. they may do personal training but the client knows what there getting into before joining. e.g. ptc the ladies know its strength/ complex time and so do the men.
some very strong words about someone you dont even know.
maybe i should of made it clear who was speaking juan Carlos “JC” Santana is a world renowned authority in the area of performance enhancement and is one of the most prolific speakers in the fitness industry.
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Kyle Aaron
Active member
Not necessarily. You're forgetting the rise in popularity of small group sessions, especially "boot camps".
It's really hard to draw precise lines where one begins and the other ends. There are definitely differences, but individuals are more different. It really comes down to an individual's common sense, experience, knowledge, empathy and the good old Care Factor.
World-renowned people can become disillusioned, bitter and twisted like the rest of us. He's still human. Plus, you know, Jillian Michaels is world-renowned, too.
I mean, maybe he's an awesome coach/trainer, I dunno. When I googled him up just now the first thing I found was his own website telling me that he's "world-renowned." Uh-huh. If you have to tell me you're famous... But let's say he is because of all the awesome training he's supervised. That doesn't necessarily mean he has an unquestionable insight on the industry as a whole.
He just sounds like one of those guys who wants to tell you how awesome he is by telling you how crap everyone else is.
Whereas me, any awesomeness I've got I stole from someone else.
Just yesterday a couple of guys said, "wow, you know so much... how long have you been in the industry?" I'd been quoting Markos and Rippetoe as I sorted out their squat/deadlifts and took away their Swiss balls.
Kyle Aaron
Active member
I have a similar list. But it adds a former teacher of mine, and Markos.
Kyle Aaron
Active member
I spent fifteen minutes with a guy in the gym yesterday. He was a runner, wanted to improve his running, leg and core strength. So I taught him to squat. I told him why his knees came together, and what squatting would do for his glute and hamstring strength, and of course core strength, helping prevent or mitigate knee injuries, etc.
"Kyle, I've been coming to this gym for ten years, and the time you've spent with me and what you've taught me now is more than all the other trainers put together over that time."
I was stunned. And embarrassed for the gym. "Um... I'm both glad and sorry. I think you'll find that if you go and ask for help, and book an appointment for a session, you'll get more help again." I had to say something.
In any service industry, there are two ways of approaching your job. You can wait for people to come and ask for service, or you can step on out there and ask who wants some. We might call it the "reactive" and "active" type of people.
When asked for help, reactive people are very helpful. When asked for information, they are very informative. The active people are helpful and informative whether asked or not.
The reactive people will never offend or annoy anyone. The active ones may do so. "Just leave me alone, mate." I have been told to bugger off by lots of people, not in those words, but it was plain they didn't like me and thought I was weird.
Of every 10 people I go and say hello to, I'd say,
- 5 obviously know what they're doing, we just chat for a bit, and I leave them to it
- 1 isn't sure what they're doing and know it, I help them
- 2 don't know what they're doing but think they know, I help them tactfully
- 1 doesn't know what they're doing and gets angry if I try to tell them
- 1 just tells me to bugger off before I even start talking to them
So I don't blame the reactive people for being reactive. Active people get told to bugger off, and have to figure out how to be tactful with people who think they know everything. Some gym-goers do actually know as much or more than some trainers - those are the first group I just chat to and leave them to it. But lots don't, and get angry when you talk to them. Those 2 guys I have to be tactful with, it's not easy to do.
When you're active, depending on how good you are at explaining things and being tactful and patient, up to half the people you speak to could be telling you to bugger off. That's enough to make anyone sit at the desk doing paperwork instead.
"Kyle, I've been coming to this gym for ten years, and the time you've spent with me and what you've taught me now is more than all the other trainers put together over that time."
I was stunned. And embarrassed for the gym. "Um... I'm both glad and sorry. I think you'll find that if you go and ask for help, and book an appointment for a session, you'll get more help again." I had to say something.
In any service industry, there are two ways of approaching your job. You can wait for people to come and ask for service, or you can step on out there and ask who wants some. We might call it the "reactive" and "active" type of people.
When asked for help, reactive people are very helpful. When asked for information, they are very informative. The active people are helpful and informative whether asked or not.
The reactive people will never offend or annoy anyone. The active ones may do so. "Just leave me alone, mate." I have been told to bugger off by lots of people, not in those words, but it was plain they didn't like me and thought I was weird.
Of every 10 people I go and say hello to, I'd say,
- 5 obviously know what they're doing, we just chat for a bit, and I leave them to it
- 1 isn't sure what they're doing and know it, I help them
- 2 don't know what they're doing but think they know, I help them tactfully
- 1 doesn't know what they're doing and gets angry if I try to tell them
- 1 just tells me to bugger off before I even start talking to them
So I don't blame the reactive people for being reactive. Active people get told to bugger off, and have to figure out how to be tactful with people who think they know everything. Some gym-goers do actually know as much or more than some trainers - those are the first group I just chat to and leave them to it. But lots don't, and get angry when you talk to them. Those 2 guys I have to be tactful with, it's not easy to do.
When you're active, depending on how good you are at explaining things and being tactful and patient, up to half the people you speak to could be telling you to bugger off. That's enough to make anyone sit at the desk doing paperwork instead.