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The repetition
- Thread starter Goosey
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spartacus
Well-known member
This is my thoughts today in line with my experience.
As most of my training is on moderate weights with short rests, my focus is on smooth movements through each exercise and feeling of muscle being targeted doing the most work to ensure maximum involvement. For example, if I am doing squats, I am more concerned with the feeling the muscle being activated and worked rather than just getting the weight up. Latter would require more weight and poorer form.
That is about it for me.
In contrast, when I do my occasional heavy sets or weeks, there is little thought beyond getting weight up according to my skill and leverage strengths.
But it is the lighter work with much greater focus on form and working the muscle that will always be most important if I am to make further gains.
As most of my training is on moderate weights with short rests, my focus is on smooth movements through each exercise and feeling of muscle being targeted doing the most work to ensure maximum involvement. For example, if I am doing squats, I am more concerned with the feeling the muscle being activated and worked rather than just getting the weight up. Latter would require more weight and poorer form.
That is about it for me.
In contrast, when I do my occasional heavy sets or weeks, there is little thought beyond getting weight up according to my skill and leverage strengths.
But it is the lighter work with much greater focus on form and working the muscle that will always be most important if I am to make further gains.
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Goosey
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Yeah, most def.
But what i see everywhere, is no emphasis on the negative, and I think that without the negative, growth is impossible.
Goosey
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The squat is a key exercise, but one exercise where Like the deadlift are not IMO effective muscle biulders.
spartacus
Well-known member
It is if done with emphasis on working muscle.
Because of broken collarbone, I merely did body weight squats other day, up to 50 rep sets.
By changing stance, shoulder stance, close and so on, I could not believe how sore I have been since.
It is amazing the difference that form makes for working a muscle in a movement.
Because of broken collarbone, I merely did body weight squats other day, up to 50 rep sets.
By changing stance, shoulder stance, close and so on, I could not believe how sore I have been since.
It is amazing the difference that form makes for working a muscle in a movement.
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0ni
Registered Rustler
It's an isometric muscle builder
Slabs of muscle on the lats and traps for sure
Maxic got pretty fat just flexing the shit out of this muscles
I think the general speed of the movement is important. The more advanced I get the more I am trying to feel the movement out, which is basically just moving it at such a speed at various points
Neddysmith
Standard kunce
I guess this comes down the old question about TUT (Time Under Tension) many bodybuilders use this as a way of completely working the muscle regardless of the weight moved, I know a couple of guys who have built quite good legs for stage by squatting a max of 100kg, but they will either do higher reps or will increase the TUT while squatting, it is also effective for other exercises like bench, pull ups, lat pull and rows, although i am not sure how effective it would be for deads, especially heavy deads.
Goosey
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Your statement in the "dip" thread got me thinking, it was a very important comment to make.
I reckon a flexible muscle is a *strong* muscle, if the negative portion of the rep was not *emphasized or not present, then there is no opportunity for the muscle to be safely stretched under load.
You know, you got to work through the full ROM, this is not possible without the proper negative movement, even safer when moved twice as slow as the positive.
I think TUL is important and a good method of judging progression, because we tend to make the rep quicker and the rep shorter as we fatigue and to get that last rep, thinking we have progressed, but in reality we have not.
0ni
Registered Rustler
This is why I always say, let the pictures do the talking
PL is different, but most of my training now is done BB style but with lower reps obviously. I've started applying this to my bench where before I was not, so it will be interesting to see what happens to my bench in the coming months for sure
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370kg - YouTube
strong enough?
Member
A super slow negative diminishes the stretch-shortening cycle, thereby diminishing power production, stimulation of fast twitch muscle fibres and ultimately the amount of weight lifted. It will induce more soreness (not necessarily correlative with more growth or strength improvement) and stimulate slower twitch fibres.
I also think that it inhibits a proper movement pattern as you have to create unnecessary tension to be able to control a weight super slowly in a bench press or squat. When performing a movement with a natural rhythm, it is much easier to ensure the right muscles are tight and the right muscles are relaxed.
It is not necessarily safer to slow down the negative. Assuming you are able to keep good positioning, the stretch reflex allows lots of power production in the most mechanically disadvantageous position of the movement and get you out of there quicker, reducing the loading on joints, tendons, ligaments etc.
A slow negative might be better for hypertrophy overall, but you are much more likely to end up big, slow and useless, then if you lift weights more dynamically and in a way that allows you to use the greatest load possible (and safely).
Olympic weightlifters barely perform any negatives. Ring gymnasts mostly hang out in isometric positions. They have no trouble with growth whatsoever, but are obviously considerably stronger than most much bigger bodybuilders who spend all their time under eccentric tension.
I also think that it inhibits a proper movement pattern as you have to create unnecessary tension to be able to control a weight super slowly in a bench press or squat. When performing a movement with a natural rhythm, it is much easier to ensure the right muscles are tight and the right muscles are relaxed.
It is not necessarily safer to slow down the negative. Assuming you are able to keep good positioning, the stretch reflex allows lots of power production in the most mechanically disadvantageous position of the movement and get you out of there quicker, reducing the loading on joints, tendons, ligaments etc.
A slow negative might be better for hypertrophy overall, but you are much more likely to end up big, slow and useless, then if you lift weights more dynamically and in a way that allows you to use the greatest load possible (and safely).
Olympic weightlifters barely perform any negatives. Ring gymnasts mostly hang out in isometric positions. They have no trouble with growth whatsoever, but are obviously considerably stronger than most much bigger bodybuilders who spend all their time under eccentric tension.
Goosey
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"Super slow" is another animal.
About the rest of your garbage, opinions will vary.
As I stated this is not about sport and the movements used, it is about exercise.
strong enough?
Member
If opinions vary, why did you post the topic if you're only going to rubbish other opinions as garbage without offering any substantive response. Poor form really.
I regard an eccentric twice as slow as the concentric as super slow.
What I wrote is applicable to anyone wanting to use exercise as a means of getting bigger and stronger. Some people will want to use exercise primarily as a means of getting big. That's fine, and a slow negative is a useful for them.
Mostly, depends on where I am in my training cycle. Sometimes I need the weight to move fast, or I'm at a point or weight where it should move fast, and if it doesn't that could be problematic. Other times, it doesn't matter how slow it is, so long as it moves. Though, I am always trying to move the weight as fast as possible. Unless I'm being stupid and need to give myself a kick in the pants.
If I want more time under tension, I'll just do more volume. The only time I slow down the negative is either if I'm dive bombing the weight and it's throwing me off, or I want to squat without a stretch reflex.
If I want more time under tension, I'll just do more volume. The only time I slow down the negative is either if I'm dive bombing the weight and it's throwing me off, or I want to squat without a stretch reflex.