Text books

[PTC]

I had a rant in the supplement section yesterday, and I've made a vow never to go in there again.

I cant stand it when people quote text books. If I want that information, I go to Google and look it up. I'm not saying text books arent accurate, its just that I'd rather here your OWN experiences, I can look up other peoples as easily as you can.

Imagine if I came on here in the strength section, cutting and pasting information from text books, I'd be ridiculed if I didnt produce real world facts with that information.

That rule doesnt apply with nutrition unfortunately.

This week I had a new client, a member from here, buy some stuff off me. He didnt require a program. He had a text book with all the best training info.

Now I'm not going to say it is or isnt a great text book. But those that usually post quotations from text books to back up their arguments may have an opinion.

Recently Kyle was shot down for questioning a quote from a text book, the guy that shot him down detests split routines and isolation exercises, really having a crack at those that post them up.

This text book that the guy is using as a guide comes from arguably the greatest BB of all time. His training must be accurate and we cant argue, its in a text book, and he is super famous and uber succesful.

To all you ass clowns that believe everything you read, and dare not question info coming from books, dont ever have a crack at anyone doing double splits with 20 sets a bodypart, morning and night, with a full compliment of isolation exercises.

Arnolds Encyclopedia of Body Building MUST be correct. He used it and got bigger AND stronger than all of us.

To the guy that emailed me, I'm not saying the book is garbage, its all the supplement gobbling isolation flaming armchair pimply experts that are.

But if you go to another section, they'll gladly quote you from a book that staring at earth worms while drinking Bonox at 11.37pm will cure Herpes.

 

[Christian]

I posted plenty of real world experience, then you make threAds like this.

Markos textbooks state the rdi of vitAmin c to be 60mg .. I don't get information from text books I get it from people who use I I real world experience. I suggest you check things out before you Truro black listme here for providing information. I also posted a thread of real world info from a man just like you but you have not found it yet..
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[Christian]

What's funny is I disregard my textbooks and go from real world experience just like you... But you don't agree so I am instantly wrong. Go find in common medical knowledge anything I share you simply won't.

So why the hate? I simply don't understand all I hav done is provide info to help people.
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[Goosey]

Fair dinkum markos, that was just churlish.

Let the mod squad do their job.
And WTF is this doing in the powerlifting forum eh?
Be consistent, LOL.
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[Goosey]

Noobs and others I find your post pretty innocuous, or who ever the phuck it's directed at.
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[Kyle Aaron]

I cant stand it when people quote text books. If I want that information, I go to Google and look it up. I'm not saying text books arent accurate, its just that I'd rather here your OWN experiences, I can look up other peoples as easily as you can.

I think this is well-put, and very positive and useful.

Expanding on what you're saying, not refuting it - we just have to bear in mind that one person's experience is just one person. It's hearing lots of different experiences, and combining that with what books tell us, then trying that out ourselves in the gym and at the dinner table - that way we muddle along towards the truth.

So long as people can understand the difference between "this is what works or doesn't work for me" and "what works for everyone." Lots of people get sort of messianic about things. "Praise the Lord, this will save us all!" One week it's kettlebells, next week it's vitamin C, week after that it's Starting Strength. Not having a go at n00bs here, lots of people do this. It's just normal human, being enthusiastic about things. Enthusiasm's great, just don't lose sight of the bigger things.

Every client I meet tells me a different fad idea. They're all convinced that this one is right, and all the rest are bullsht. Well, they can't all be right.
"Drink a gallon of milk a day!"
"But milk gives you cancer!"
And both can quote studies and textbooks and fad diets saying they're right. Which one to believe? Well... neither.

Sane middle ground must be found for us to work in. People's experiences are valid and useful. Textbooks we can read ourselves. For member of the month, I didn't nominate someone producing articles, even though I find many of them interesting. I nominated someone who lifts heavy despite real difficulties. Tablesalt squatting heavy every day while waiting for a lung transplant, that guy is an example to us all. You could sole your shoes with his guts. Articles are interesting, and I hope people keep posting them, but for sheer inspiration to get under the iron you can't go past a guy like that.

 

[Goosey]

Hmmm. Nicely put K.
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[haz]

to most new ideas, people over-react, then get rid of the things they hate.
using the milk example. a person may try 3 litres of milk, gain 2kg and see their lifts rise but hate drinking so much milk so they lessen it to 1litre. and they find they get similar benefits.

same with diets, a person may follow a low carb diet and have to be sure to have protein at every meal, after 6 weeks they go off the diet but now know how easy it is to include protein at every meal.

 

[Christian]

Exercise is a little different to nutrition... Exercise is all based on movement of some kind be it one with a heavy weight light weight barbell kettle bell whatever..

That is very different to an organic substance used by the body to complete a task...

I doubt anyone has read the gentlemans story i published.

It isn't about "beliefs" or fads... It is about what works. I'm a bit disappointed with this thread actually markos I hold you so highly respect, but you can not compare training to nutrition..

After all people rubbish your methods and you come back with real world examples...

I do the same but some how when it's metaling it isn't relivent. I don't understand...

People can think vitamins are pixie dust for all I care people can keep eating crap food it's all ignorance in the end.
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[Kyle Aaron]

Sure, I read the guy's story. And it's great. But I've also read stories of people praying to Jesus and their cancer remitting. Does that mean I'll give away being Jewish and praise Jesus? No.

Like I said, one person's experience is one person's experience. It's valid and to be respected, but it's still just one person. You have to look at a wide variety of experiences. And then take studies - which are a formalised way of looking at experiences - and add them to those stories. Then just try things and see. Muddle along, and don't expect miracle cures.

As you age you get some humility because you've changed your mind a few times. You realise, what I know now isn't all I'll ever know. You can look back on the posts online of any of us from the last year or two and find us saying something different to what we'd say now. Does that mean we're stupid and hypocritical? Probably not. More likely, time's passed, we had some different experiences, we learned something.

And the most important thing we learned is that there's always more to learn. There's no One True Perfect Way for everything. There are some pretty good ways, and some pretty crappy ways - but no One True Perfect Way.

I'm just glad the internet didn't exist when I was around 19. I really wouldn't like to be quoted on some of the stuff I said then. Sure, you can find quotes of my saying some stupid stuff in the past few years, but it mostly won't be totally stupid. Opinions on this will vary, of course

 

[Christian]

Sure, I read the guy's story. And it's great. But I've also read stories of people praying to Jesus and their cancer remitting. Does that mean I'll give away being Jewish and praise Jesus? No.

Like I said, one person's experience is one person's experience. It's valid and to be respected, but it's still just one person. You have to look at a wide variety of experiences. And then take studies - which are a formalised way of looking at experiences - and add them to those stories. Then just try things and see. Muddle along, and don't expect miracle cures.

As you age you get some humility because you've changed your mind a few times. You realise, what I know now isn't all I'll ever know. You can look back on the posts online of any of us from the last year or two and find us saying something different to what we'd say now. Does that mean we're stupid and hypocritical? Probably not. More likely, time's passed, we had some different experiences, we learned something.

And the most important thing we learned is that there's always more to learn. There's no One True Perfect Way for everything. There are some pretty good ways, and some pretty crappy ways - but no One True Perfect Way.

I'm just glad the internet didn't exist when I was around 19. I really wouldn't like to be quoted on some of the stuff I said then. Sure, you can find quotes of my saying some stupid stuff in the past few years, but it mostly won't be totally stupid. Opinions on this will vary, of course

No it doesnt show that a religion is "correct" but it shows 1 important fact you missed, that praying and faith do something...

And guess what, we actually know what thats it, it increases serotonin and this bluntins cortisol.. Cortisol is a marker for inflamaiton in the body and increases oxidative stress cortisol also suppresses the immune system kyle.

Now what fights the cancer and disease? Could it be your immune system?!?!

So you just showed me how a real world experience in lowering cortisol can help a suppressed immune system to funtion correctly..

Its funny how all the pixies dissapear when you know how things work..

We know compound exercises work because of their effecton hormone profile testosterone and growth hormone and the constant repair needed and increased metabolism after exercise...

Miracles are defined as "things we dont know how they happened"

We know about leeky gut, we also know that something like 60% of neruotransmitters are in the gut... We also know what allergies do to people...

You can rubbish things as oh thats a one of.. But until you dig for yourself and find waht is you will allways think the way you guys do...

Not that there is anything wrong with that its your opinion on something, but thats when you keep it to yourself because real world experience tells us other wise..

The only reason you dont see it is you dont look, or you look but you dont see..

Im expecting a newsletter to markos

 

[Christian]

And Kyle you are right in a sense.. About "Experiences" in a sense... There is no point not to drink milk or eat meat unless it gives you problems that is fairly common sense..

But vitmains minerals ect all have the same funcitons in peoples bodies most of the time.. It just that demands for them change.

What i post is for people with problems that ask & why .. Anti depressants dont cure depression, they block serotonin reuptake, Insulin doesnt cure beta cells of the pancreas it replaces insulin and causes atrophy of the pancreas in certain instances. Medicine band aids. The only thing that has the capability to heal anything is your body..

Yes if you have a terrible lifethreating infeciton antibiotics will help kill the ifneciton and allow your body to heal by not focusing on illing the infecitn itself.. But other drugs do not cure disease nor are they designed to.

Im not telling people DONT DO THIS! turn into a vegan im simply providing infomation for people that may need it...

I dont know what all the hostility is about. You can all believe and say what ever you want to say.

 

[PTC]

I've not read a single post, I'm not interested unless Christian reads Arnolds book then apologizes to everyone he has had a crack at for doing isolation work.

Mods can lock this if they want, I've said all I want to say.

If Kyle hadnt been attacked the way he was, I wouldnt have bothered commenting, that was dreadful and uncalled for.

Kyle does work in our sport, that I would never undertake. If he didnt do it, I dont know who would. He has an open mind and takes each case on its merits. His view should be listened to by everyone. He should not be attacked for voicing an opinion.

Kyle, Fadi and Dave are the 3 most sensible open minded people that post on here. You may not agree with what they say, but they all deserve a higher level of respect than most of us, me included.

I know my pig headed way isnt the best, thats why I listen to Dave, Fadi and Kyle. I may argue with them, but they get my maximum respect, even if it doesnt come through on the forum.

Christian is and always will be a mate, from before this forum, but just like me, everyone needs a clip over the ears every now and again.

I have recieved pm's from others who are over Christians "health" posts.

Christian is free to quote any text book in the supplement section, I'll express my rights and simply not go in there anymore, one venture in, look what happens.

 

[Christian]

I've not read a single post, I'm not interested unless Christian reads Arnolds book then apologizes to everyone he has had a crack at for doing isolation work.

Mods can lock this if they want, I've said all I want to say.

If Kyle hadnt been attacked the way he was, I wouldnt have bothered commenting, that was dreadful and uncalled for.

Kyle does work in our sport, that I would never undertake. If he didnt do it, I dont know who would. He has an open mind and takes each case on its merits. His view should be listened to by everyone. He should not be attacked for voicing an opinion.

Kyle, Fadi and Dave are the 3 most sensible open minded people that post on here. You may not agree with what they say, but they all deserve a higher level of respect than most of us, me included.

I know my pig headed way isnt the best, thats why I listen to Dave, Fadi and Kyle. I may argue with them, but they get my maximum respect, even if it doesnt come through on the forum.

Christian is and always will be a mate, from before this forum, but just like me, everyone needs a clip over the ears every now and again.

I have recieved pm's from others who are over Christians "health" posts.

Christian is free to quote any text book in the supplement section, I'll express my rights and simply not go in there anymore, one venture in, look what happens.

The crack at kyle came from a few things 1 of them was an unrelated topic where i posted somehtingas a joke and he had a go at me.

Anyway thats over and done with..

I would prefer it if you read the posts markos.


All i want is people to know what they are eating, be fitter, healthier, strogner... And for people with problems find out how they can help them...

 

[PTC]

Not everyone is sick like you Christian.

One guy on here eats like a sparrow and we have him avoiding every known quality food, yet he complains he cant add weight.

Maybe we need another sub section, for the "weak and frail"

 

[Martigan]

From what i have seen i don't think n00bs is the poster you see on some forums that just posts random articles without doing the research in real life as well as study as he seems to be very educated on the matters he puts forth and it's a bit of a joke to make a thread to call the bloke out because you have different opinions, Why not post in the thread at hand at the time of reading if you have further information to add that might shed some light on the topic been discussed.

 

[Oli]

Better yet would be a 'nutrition' section as we know it and a 'detox' section for those interested in organic health.

You dont need to eat Z's ultra squeaky clean food grown in his organic japanese pebble garden to be strong and healthy. It might not be AS healthy, but we're talking a tiny % here.

Nobodies saying organic stuff doesnt work, but lately the lines between organic food and naturopathy and weightlifting have been well and truly blurred. We need to stop now before we have an army of vibram five finger squatters.

From what i have seen i don't think n00bs is the poster you see on some forums that just posts random articles without doing the research in real life as well as study as he seems to be very educated on the matters he puts forth and it's a bit of a joke to make a thread to call the bloke out because you have different opinions, Why not post in the thread at hand at the time of reading if you have further information to add that might shed some light on the topic been discussed.

thats the thing small font, we dont have any studies to argue with him. I'm a law student, not a nutritionist, I dont spend my days researching what I eat. However, I cant just assume that someone coming from the left field is right because they have a keen interest in the area.

I'm actually a technocrat. I want to replace all forms of government with super computers and professional bodies. I can back this up with a lot of law reports, does this mean I'm right simply because you dont follow law reports and therefore cant argue with me? does it mean either of us are right because we can source out law reports that support our arguments?

 

[Christian]

Not everyone is sick like you Christian.

One guy on here eats like a sparrow and we have him avoiding every known quality food, yet he complains he cant add weight.

Maybe we need another sub section, for the "weak and frail"

Thats slack markos... Im not weak or frail i just have health problems, and people with health problems or disabilities shouldnt be looked at as weak and frail..

I never told anyone to not eat food...

I said dont eat shit food.

I never told anyone not to dirnk or eat milk i only told sticky to avoid milk because of his personal condition..

I only posted the depression article to open peoples eyes into what can cause problems..

If you dont have problems terrific dont avoid certain shit but if you do and you want to know why and fix it come and see me..

Not sure why people think im against food? Im against poison..

 

[Christian]

Better yet would be a 'nutrition' section as we know it and a 'detox' section for those interested in organic health.

You dont need to eat Z's ultra squeaky clean food grown in his organic japanese pebble garden to be strong and healthy. It might not be AS healthy, but we're talking a tiny % here.

Nobodies saying organic stuff doesnt work, but lately the lines between organic food and naturopathy and weightlifting have been well and truly blurred. We need to stop now before we have an army of vibram five finger squatters.

Thats why there is a spirituality General health ect forum that i post stuff in...


I postin the
Discussions for General health and wellbeing , healthy mind and spirit,motivation and self-esteem


If you notice we have 2 nutrition sections 1 is for Bodybuilding powerlfiting nutrition the other is for general health infomation...


People dont like having their bubbles burst it means their lifestyle they are leading is not as peachy as they thought it is and change bothers people...

I never told anyone to be weak. I never told anyone not to eat. I am simply an advocate for not putting poison in yourmouth... Ill eat 6 organic hormone free eggs for breakfast with a whey shake 3 pieces of fruit and yoghurt.

Whats wrong with that...

Read my above post oliver.. I never told anyone not to eat food.. Eat half a cow i dont give a **** i know i do.. I dont understand where people are getting this infomation that im some vegan hippy...

 

[PTC]

Obviously you didnt read my response in the thread big fella.

Christian posted some crap about a vitamin that put astronaughts on Venus, when Kyle questioned it, he was set upon.

Not cool.

For everything found on the internet, there is opposing data

Recent rat and human studies suggest that adding Vitamin C supplements to an exercise training program can cause a decrease in mitochondria production, hampering endurance capacity.[139] A cancer-causing mechanism of hexavalent chromium may be triggered by vitamin C.[

All I'm saying is I can look that shit up myself, I dont need ONE persons point of view telling me its gospel.