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Strength training 101

P

PTC

Member
I spent some time reading through journals today, and I'm dumbstruck by what some people are calling strength workouts.

Now, you guys can hate me and dislike the way I treat some of you, but you cant deny my clients get results, and are strong.

If I couldnt get lifters strong, I would be out of business.

Now, if you really want to get strong, I mean really strong, not just stronger than your mum, you have to train very hard. Nobody is going to give you a 200kg deadlift because you simply rocked up.

I use percentages to work out training poundages. You need to be using over 85% of your 1RM if you plan on getting stronger. Now 85% is a START point. I see some of you are using this as a finishing point, and doing doubles and triples with it.

Let me explain. Alen squats 165kg, its what he squatted at BATB3 less than 2 weeks ago, it's his PB.

Last night he squatted 140kg x 12. If you calculate 85% of 165kg you'll find that its 140kg. He does 12 reps with that. If you are even doing just 3-4 reps with that, its not enough.

You guys see 42 lifters deadlifting 200kg in a garage, over a 14 lifters benching between 140-170kg. I know strength. Its not theory.

Anybody can claim to be a strength coach. Massive difference between coach and lifter. A coach can make ANYONE strong, a lifter only makes himself strong.

So the number one rule is, if your goal is simply to get stronger, then ALL your work sets should be at 85 % and higher, much higher. Anything lighter is fluff. Please, please do more than one work set on a strength program.

Secondly, dont avoid the hard exercises, embrace them. Squats are non negotiable, you simply must do them, end of story.

You can subsitute deadlift with UDL's or Romanian deadlifts, and either press standing up or lying down. Include a quick lift. Row something.

Do the above 3 times a week. Increase the weights whenever possible, next thing you know, you'll be stronger. Keep doing it consistently for 2 years, and you'll total 700kg+.

A workout for size and weight increase is structured differently, and its a great thing to do, because with added bodyweight, you'll be stronger, its why there are weight divisions in lifting comps.
 
PTC said:
Now 85% is a START point. I see some of you are using this as a finishing point, and doing doubles and triples with it.
Click to expand...

I hadnt sat down and figured out my percentages, might do that before I go to the gym this afternoon and adjust accordingly. Thankyou.:)
 
Bluey said:
I hadnt sat down and figured out my percentages, might do that before I go to the gym this afternoon and adjust accordingly. Thankyou.:)
Click to expand...

same here but im pretty certain all my work sets are around 85% or above. most sets have me finishing just under my PB with single reps especially deads, squats and cleans. BP and MP i tend to do 5x5 which my MP is at 85% but the BP is a fair bit under that, i'd have to add 10kg to the worksets to get it to 85%.....
 
When you get over 85% of your 1RM, what sort of reps should you look at doing?

85% x 10
90% x 6
95% x 4

??
 
Very good question Josh, and one I cant answer, everyone has a different ammount of fast twitch and slow twitch fibers.

I suggest load up a bar at 85%, then 90% and finally 95% and work it out. Try and leave one rep in the bank, ie, if you manage 100kg x 5 on the bench and couldnt possibly get a 6th, I'm happy for you to stop at 4 on most sets, just get stronger and keep increasing the weights.

This is one of the reasons all my clients get PB's at comps, they are allowed to push to failure.
 
It would be interesting to see Fadi and Markos discuss (or debate?) training to failure. One seems very much against it, the other in favour of it. I think we could all learn a lot just seeing them discuss it, why they believe and train as they do.

I mean, when two experts disagree, what are the rest of us supposed to do? :p
 
I dont think either of them are in favour of training to failure, i think markos' was saying that failure was to be avoided in general training (by leaving a rep in the bank on worksets), with the exception of competition.
 
I'm no expert Kyle, just a gym hack

Your wasting your time Dan, Kyle is intent on stirring up trouble, not learning, I clearly state to leave one in the bank, as does Fadi, Kyle simply sees what he wants to then has a sook and dobs when he gets offended.

Grow up Kyle.
 
Get over yourself, Markos. If I thought you were offensive I would not be telling people to go train with you. I'm not on this forum to stir trouble, I have a life. I'm here to learn.

After you've had so many years in the gym and training others, if that's not an expert, I don't know what is.

Now, you said,

"This is one of the reasons all my clients get PB's at comps, they are allowed to push to failure."

which is different to what Fadi says. Now, obviously both approaches do work. So I am interested in seeing knowledgeable people talking about their different approaches. I don't expect anything to be "proven" either way, I just expect to learn a lot from what they say.
 
Kyle you read it wrong..

He said leave one in the bank

then at comps they are aloud to go to fialure so they get a pb then..
 
I suggest load up a bar at 85%, then 90% and finally 95% and work it out. Try and leave one rep in the bank, ie, if you manage 100kg x 5 on the bench and couldnt possibly get a 6th, I'm happy for you to stop at 4 on most sets, just get stronger and keep increasing the weights.

If you want to learn, learn to read.

Oh, and you are a trouble maker, scouring other forums and quoting what I said on them lol

Why didnt you quote what Hawkpeter said about you on ns.com, that was way funnier.
 
Josh_GTiR said:
When you get over 85% of your 1RM, what sort of reps should you look at doing?

85% x 10
90% x 6
95% x 4

??
Click to expand...

Ok first thing’s first; as far as going to failure is concerned, I wrote a whole article on it which can be summed up in 6 words: leave one rep in the tank.

Now Josh, re this dilemma of how many reps should one performs based on his 1RM. I say there’s no law that says we can not test for a 10RM, 15RM, or a 20RM, each set of reps offering a unique stimulus to the muscle fibers. When your training cycle is focused on hypertrophy over strength (and muscle density), then you base your percentages on the rep scheme you’re performing at that time.

Example: Week#1 is a H (hypertrophy week). Here I will use the 10/15/20 RM to workout my percentages. If I can b/bell curl 100lb for a 10RM and today being Monday and a light day, then I’ll do 75% of that 10RM which equals to 75lb x10. Wednesday for example could be a 15 rep/set day and the same percentage would apply, i.e. 75% of 15RM x 15 etc.

Week #2 can have you increase the load to 80% etc

Another option here could be the utilization of mixed training, where strength AND Hypertrophy are used in the same week based on priorities. Monday could be a S day whilst Wednesday & Fridays a H day etc. It’s nothing that can not be put down on paper, calculated based not on guess work, but rather on real life different Rep Maximums that were performed by you.

If you take a look at my sig, you’ll find that I do list a 1RM, a 10RM, and a 20RM. Now imagine working out a 20 rep squat set based on your 1RM. It can be done for sure, but won’t be as accurate as basing it on a 20RM. So on a light day based on my sig, I can do 80% of my 20RM by loading the bar with just 105kg and doing say 2x20.

The name of the game here is upping the intensity by its many variables. One of these variables is increasing your weights by using different rep percentages, based on a continuously improving RMs.

I’ll leave it here.


Fadi.
 
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But if u can deadlift 400kg wont you just be strong full stop?

Hypertrophy or not you will be a unit?

I really hate how the ugys at the gym do those arm tiwst things with 5 kilos for like 3 x 15.. I mean come on.
 
n00bs said:
But if u can deadlift 400kg wont you just be strong full stop?

Hypertrophy or not you will be a unit?

I really hate how the ugys at the gym do those arm tiwst things with 5 kilos for like 3 x 15.. I mean come on.
Click to expand...

Yes of course noobs; most certainly one will be a unit!


Fadi.
 
But Fadi, this is MY thread, and its called strength training 101.

Why confuse matters with a % of your 20RM, its pointless.

The percentages I mention are what I use to make clients strong.

Check the lifts at BATB or the AUSBB record board, they work, full stop.

Lets keep this one thread on track and talk about strength. Not deadlifting empty bars for one trillion reps, or doing calisthenics for 10 minutes.

This thread, in the powerlifting section, is about strength.
 
PTC & Fadi, I'd love what you have to say about prilepin's table?

To me it makes a lot of sense, the right rep ranges within the right %'s. I saw Markos that you highly encourage 85% + work so you probably see a good bit of merit in the table
 
It looks very good to me, but there will always be exceptions.

It states that when using 80% of 1RM you should do 2-4 reps. Hmmmmmmmmmm.

Last night Max squatted 125kg x 20. His 1RM is 156kg. 80% of 156kg is 125kg. Should he have stopped at 2-4.....I think not, I feel he may have got some benefit from doing 20 reps, but thats just me.

The table is a good guide though, nice find.
 
I personally am a big fan of it. I think because I"m more 'science' than 'art'. To every rule there's an exception hey! With the program i'm doing now, last night for example i did 5 reps @ 85%, for both the bench press & deadlift. I've worked up to it tho & next week the volume isn't as crazy
 
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