5 day BB splits
I found it a great way to ignore a muscle group that recovered 1,2,3 or 4 days ago, simply because its not 'chest Monday' again yet
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Prob not training hard enough then haha
What level of muscularity / strength does someone need to have to actually benefit more from 5 day isolation splits rather than focusing on the things that make the most difference?
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What level of muscularity / strength does someone need to have to actually benefit more from 5 day isolation splits rather than focusing on the things that make the most difference?
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Never heard of 8/6/3. I don't think that variant was in circulation back when I gave 5/3/1 a run for its money. *looks up 8/6/3* Okay, at a cursory skim, that seems to be more or less the same thing, just with slightly lower starting weights. Same method, though. The original program's designed so that realistically you could get about 10/8/4-5 on the top sets of the first cycle, so this doesn't look like a significant enough change to be particularly noteworthy. If I were to do anything like 5/3/1 again, I wouldn't worry at all about the details on the sets leading up to the top set. I'd just warm up for the top load and go for it. But I would use those lower percentages to reverse pyramid down after the top set. So, instead of doing 65%/75%/85% in week 1, I'd do 85%/75%/65%, and I'd treat all three sets the same way Jim Wendler recommends treating the top set. Of course, that means that if I were to do 5/3/1 again, I actually wouldn't do 5/3/1. But I'm okay with that.RyanF: did you ever look at 5/3/1 variants such as 8/6/3? Usually most of the criticism is aimed at Wendler's vagueness about assistance work, or that the progression is 'too slow' (i personally don't agree if you derive your TM from your true 1RM).
I found doing 5 day body part splits totally ineffective as a rank beginner; I got more strength and better looking legs from squatting 3 times a week rather than doing leg curls, squat, leg extension, leg press, seated and standing calf raises on 'leg day', which not only gave me crippling DOMS the next day, but didn't seem to really make any difference week to week.
Any ridiculous "movie star" workouts which are usually a variation on the junk in muscle mags
The routines that the "PT"s at the gym hand out, which are all on Nautilus machines followed up with db curls, db flyes and shoulder press. No barbell work at all.
The problem I had with it when I gave it a run for its money was that all the volume is in the lighter work -- there's not enough practice in the actual focal point of the program, which meant that my strength endurance went right up during it (which was thoroughly needed after a long time grinding against the brick wall that is the above 5x5 type programs), while my top end strength stagnated. In essence, my issues here come down to application of the SAID principle.
Anyone can do a 5 day split, just like anyone could do a 3 day or 4 day split - just because its 5 days doesnt mean its isolation based - I dont think anyone who has any idea how to train would simply do isolation movements - your always going to have your core lifts in there like bench, deadlift, squat, mil press, bent over rows, db rows, db bench, etc etc - its not about designing a split around the cable machine haha - alot of strength athletes and powerlifters will still do a 4 or 5 day split with "bodybuilding" movements in there - I dont think a strength athlete should shy away from thoughs movements nor should a bodybuilder shy away from those core movements - you'll find the most succesfull lifters will normally have a good mix between the 2.
And at the end of the day its what you put into a program that will = the results you get out of it....
I haven't read Beyond 5/3/1, I've just got the original manual. I'm googling this, so hopefully the descriptions I'm getting accurately reflect Wendler's intention. From what I'm gathering, Joker sets sound like something I do on occasion, typically when I've been dikking around in the gym for a while and, after doing my work sets for an exercise, decide I need to do something to refocus. 1 AMRAP down set sounds a lot like what I would do if I were ever to give 5/3/1 another run.What are your thoughts on Beyond 5/3/1 where Wendler introduces the concept of joker sets and 1 AMRAP down set which addresses both top end strength and strength endurance work? The Down Sets are for adding some high rep work but not necessary if you're doing high rep assistance. Joker Sets are awesome though, I try to do them every day and love it.
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