Anyone game to say how much PEDs help your performance?

possible more benefit, but i have never met anyone who gained more than 20% strength. Others, however, swear you get more strength from very high doses.

spartacus said:

any halfwit can work out that hard training and good food is very important. I am talking abut effect of PEDS, which i understand you have never taken.

Do you know any athletes that have?

My observations are mostly from top athletes. Aussie champions many of them. And guess what, they still got at least 15% strength gain, virtually all of them. If any told me otherwise, i would indicate. But not one.

Thread asks for estimates of gains. Not philosophy.

i am open to new info from other PED users.

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What do you mean it has no effect on PED's - are you saying regardless of the training/food you eat that if you are taking PED's you will have a bigger % in overall results than someone who has a "good diet" and "good training" but is not taking PED's?

Of course I know people who are/have taken PED's lol

How are people getting these %'s? You would generally find when someone is using they are training hard, eating better + taking into account the general gain you would get from simply going through that phase of training using or not....

I understand you will get a lift but if a powerlifter lifts a total of 500kg in A. Meet natural and then 6 months later has used PED's and lifts in B. Comp and totals 700kg then how do you workout what the % gain is from drugs, what % is from possibly improved diet, what % is simply from 6 months more training?

I guess if you were to put a % on it - on avg - anywhere from 5-20% - I guess - but so many factors at play you would be hard fought to say X%

others who were national champs in powerlifting, also tell me what they got when they later competed as a natural. One, who i will not name, had 15% difference between best drug total and best clean total.

Of course, there will be no exact figure, but i know few who gained less than 15% when all variables are taken into account.

athletes are good guides to go on, because they have often needed to pass competition tests prior to 1988 when OCT was introduced, so have a fare idea about what benefit they got when on a cycle and when off.

I have knowledge from around 10-15 athletes, all at a good level bar myself, and no one got less than 15%. Not one.

I have no knowledge of the benefit kids, women or those with low test get from going on gear. I only know from myself, mates and other top athletes I hung with over the years. All of which had considerable experience, good diets, and no health problems.