About becoming a personal trainer

"Howcome I never see anyone doing squats in gyms without a trainer?"
"Because they're pussies."
"What?"
"Think of the trouble you are having doing these squats, how much easier is bench press?"
"Heaps easier."
"So if you were on your own, would you squat? Or just bench press."
"I wouldn't squat."
"There you go. On your own you would avoid doing difficult things, even if the difficult things could get you better results. People who avoid doing difficult things which could get them better results are pussies. Rest time over, do another set."

He also commented on a fairly buff woman at the other gym who happens to be a trainer, and complained that she was often correcting the exercise form of him and his friends, wouldn't let them do anything less than perfectly and kept getting them to use more weight. Ten minutes later he asked me if I thought only male trainers would train people hard.

Sigh.

He's just learning, it takes time.

Lol that's why I'm glad I went into a gym with guys who were genuinely strong (even if they were in the other half)
At least I had some understanding of what the strong guys did to get strong (just took me a while to work out that's what I should be doing too lol)

Markos had a girl come in, reasonably fit and obviously training for some kind of physical test (she was a nurse so maybe ambo?)
Had a chuckle when she said she didn't want to look like the Hulk despite there being some very un-Hulkish people pushing around a lot more weight than she was
From markos' response he obviously hears similar things a lot lol

Well, the women always say, "but I don't want to bulk up." This is my response, all the snappy one-liners are stolen from Markos.


They react with alarm and terror at the idea of eating substantial amounts of food - women are meant to starve themselves into non-existence, didn't you know? - shake their heads nervously and maybe laugh a little bit. They're never quite convinced but there you go, it gets them going. And once they're moving they don't argue, they're too out of breath.

Yeah bit hard to argue if youve collapsed in a heap on the floor lol

I use brittanys deadlift video on YouTube as an example fairly often if a girl who's strong but wouldn't be mistaken for popeye

Evidence of their eyes does not convince them, alas. Getting women to lift heavy and give up cardio is like getting men to do proper deep squats and give up curls. You can do it, but you need to be very fucking confident about things, have a pretty forceful demeanour.

Do you get them to completely give up cardio? Or just make sure they're lifting enough as well?

I think by cardio Kyle means getting them to give up 99% of the time on treadmills and bikes

The lack of testosterone in women will inhibit the process, pretty simple.

More often than not a female will respond more positively to a template constructed around higher reps and lighter weight to the traditional low rep workout.
30 to 50 for the lower body.
And moving very quickly between equipment.

PTC said:

I think by cardio Kyle means getting them to give up 99% of the time on treadmills and bikes

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Pretty much.

Or rather, they don't need to pay me to watch them on a treadmill. For in-session cardio we have kettlebells. For example,
1'00" swings
1'00" squats
1'00" overhead press
1'00 rest
repeat for however many sets, perhaps with heavier KB.

Or not officially cardio but just take a normal workout and try to do it in half an hour, that'll get your heart pumping. It will provide a benefit for their cardiovascular fitness, and give them that puffed feeling women seem to love getting from their workouts.

If after a session they want to jump on the treadmill, I won't stop them. They usually just leave the gym, though. Apparently they feel tired or something.

Silverback said:

The lack of testosterone in women will inhibit the process, pretty simple.

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Certainly. But long before they reach a limit due to testosterone, they'll reach a limit due to nutrition. That's a big obstacle for everyone, but an especially big one for women. Women will very rarely be willing to eat big. You could supplement them with Vitamin T in obscene and dangerous amounts, if they say, "I'll just have the salad," not a lot is going to happen.

Cheers. Figured the 'they don't need me to use a treadmill' would be the most likely answer

I think walking is an excellent exercise for a deconditioned person. I'm not in favour of a gym membership or PT sessions just to walk or run on a treadmill. On really rainy days and such I can see it, fair enough, but those are not every day.

I'm also pretty much a greenie, so my general rule is if the journey is under 5km walk it, under 15km cycle it, and over 15km use public transport. Thus you get your light cardio exercise without any gym membership at all. If the A to B lacks good ways to cycle or train/bus, oh well then not your fault, drive. Moving more often under your own power is good for the environment, preserves scarce fossil fuel resources, saves you money, and promotes your general health and wellbeing. Cars have made us weak.

I don't like waste, either. Some treadmills cost around $12,000, some with computer games attached up to $25,000. Like the shoulder press machine costing $4,500, I think of all the dumbbells or kettlebells you could buy with that, or how many quality power racks and barbells.

Not only do they not need my help to plod on the treadmill, they don't need my encouragement. People just naturally gravitate to it. I try to draw them away to more productive workouts.

Do people ever complain of you training them too hard?

I've had a couple of people come to me saying they couldn't walk for 2 days after i made them do bodyweight squats..?

Did you explain to them beforehand what DOMS was?

You can't really regress too much from bw squats though I guess lol

paxton999 said:

Do people ever complain of you training them too hard?

I've had a couple of people come to me saying they couldn't walk for 2 days after i made them do bodyweight squats..?

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They tend not to complain it was "too hard", but some deconditioned beginners do claim that ordinary old DOMS is severe injury. Soreness comes from a novel exercise or effort. Any exercise or effort is novel to a deconditioned beginner, so they'll be very sore.

Basically, many are physically lazy - they're people with a strong resistance to effort. Yheir resistance to effort extends to every day life, too - they've avoided any and all exertion - so they are unusually weak and unfit. So they just don't know what exertion feels like.

If they say they were unable to walk, ask them if they missed work or school. The effort-resistant tend to actually do stuff if they've the motivation to do it, like getting paid, not getting hassled by the boss or spouse or teachers, etc.

As Hammie says, you have to let them know at the beginning of the session that they're likely to be sore tomorrow, that this does not mean they have suffered permanent and disabling injury, and so on. There's a difference between "not used to exertion and a bit nervous" and "truly lazy." There's hope for the first lot, none for the second.

I've not had any success with the truly lazy. As well as being slack in sessions they tend to be unreliable, missing sessions with little or no notice. So I've fired them all so far (6 clients).

The Hamburgler said:

You can't really regress too much from bw squats though I guess lol

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You can do half-squats, these are very popular. And leg press, etc.

Yeah that's true

I don't own a leg press though so that's out of the question lol
I'd start with 1/4 then move to either box squats or assisted squats to parallel, then once that's downpat full squats
Putting a block under the heels helps for those less flexible I've noticed (mainly through my brother and a couple of friends)

Georgina is a fellow trainer looking to get strong and learn some more about barbell training, she typically trains elderly deconditioned people in groups, so my style of training is one she knows but isn't practiced with. Today she did a barbell squat and rack pull for the first time. She is about 50kg, short.

After the obvious warmups, she squatted 30kg 3x5, rack pulled 40kg 2x5, and did a one-armed dumbbell overhead press with 7.5kg 4x8 with heels together - her midsection is not as strong as it needs to be, shoulder strength is less important for her. I think it's a fine start for her.

It'll do me good to train with someone who will question lots of things, keep me on my toes.

End 2010 Review

Coming to the end of 2010, it seems a good time to review progress so far. As with this whole thread, I want to give interested people a good idea of what they can expect when entering the fitness industry. Many people expect a bit too much, simply multiplying a PT session's hourly rate by 40 hours to get their expected income, and then getting disappointed when that doesn't happen in the first week. It's a rather slower process than that.

I consider here only the work done at the gyms.

• I have applied for 12 jobs.
• I interviewed for 7 of these.
• 3 of 7 had a practical interview, 4 did not.
• All 3 with a practical interview and 1 without invited me to work with them.
• I accepted 3 of these jobs. 2 began in the last week of July, a 3rd begins in January.
• I have worked for 23 weeks at these 2 gyms.
• I did 515.25 hours' gym instructor work
• I did 134.00 hours' personal training work, or about 200 separate sessions (some were a full hour)
• thus an average of 28 hours a week work. Obviously this is less in the first months and more now. And the PT work is now roughly the same hours as the gym work.
• PT half-hour sessions were: July 8, August 20, September 31, October 60, November 74, December 75 (the last week or so of December has few or no clients for obvious reasons).
• done PT with 27 different clients (in 2 cases, a "client" was a couple).
• Of the 27 clients, 12 still train with me, 15 do not.
• of the 15 no longer training with me, 10 quit and 5 were fired.
• of the 10 who quit, 6 had vouchers giving them 6 free sessions only, 1 never showed up once, 1 got pregnant and could not continue training, 1 moved suburbs, and 1 found training too hard.
• of the 5 who were fired, all were fired for failing the 2/3 test, they must have at least 2 of 3 of likeable, reliable and hardworking; reliability was usually the key issue.
• 9 of 12 ongoing clients were recruited by me, and 10 of 15 former clients. Basically the same. However, 8 of 15 clients remain at one gym, and 4 of 12 at the other. The first gym has direct debit PT memberships, the second gym is "pay as you go."
• 8 of the total 27 clients were direct debit, 19 were pay-as-you-go or one-offs or vouchers. 7 of the 8 direct debits are still with me, and the 1 who isn't had not even one session, never showed up. Only 4 of the 19 pay-as-you-go or voucher clients remain.
• I have earned $14,200 after tax ($620 a week on average). and brought in $10,225 in income for the gyms in the form of PT session fees.
• to achieve this, I had to get up before 0500 on at least 3 days a week.

Some conclusions from this,

• My resume writing is not as good as my interviewing, and my interviewing is not as good as my coaching skills and rapport with people in the gym
• the fitness industry offers mostly casual part-time jobs, and you need multiple jobs to have a liveable income (ie a bit more than full-time minimum wage). After 12 months or so you could have a decent income with a single job (ie double or more minimum wage).
• by simply getting out on the gym floor and talking to people, I get a new client each week or two, but only around half of these clients will be ongoing, others only around for a short time, either quitting or being fired.
• thus at any one time, around 2/3 the clients are ongoing, and 1/3 are coming or going.
• overall, half of potential clients come from the PT being outgoing and interested in people, and half come through the centre; more outgoing trainers will recruit 3/4 or more of their own clients, and lazier trainers 1/4 or less
• around half of clients go for a single half-hour session each week, and the other half for 2 or more. Obviously as time goes on you may find the single session people move up to double sessions.
• if the trainer's PT hours equal or exceed their gym shift hours, they will cost the centre nothing, or turn a profit for them. Since the trainer might expect 10 gym shift hours, they need to do 10 hours of PT to impress their manager. This is 6-8 clients.
• 6-8 clients takes 6-8 weeks to get, and the same time again to have that many regular reliable clients with another 3-4 short-term or unreliable ones floating around. Thus, around 3 months before the person is established. Of course, some trainers never manage it.
• When people have to take action to do something, they tend not to take action. Cancelling a direct debit requires action, so they continue with what they're doing; paying for each session requires an action, so they may or may not continue with it.
• retaining clients is twice as easy when they are paying their PT sessions as they do their gym membership compared to when they pay as they go. How successful would gyms be if people only paid when they showed up? Same with PT.
• this last tells you why I have accepted a 3rd job.

One of the best threads on the site kyle. I hope it starts getting more profitable for you soon.

Although by the sounds of it you don't do them I'd like to add:
Group sessions are where the money is at

Kyle,

How do you handle sessions where the client does not show up?

Do you still charge the client? Do you charge unless x amount of notice is given? Legit excuse needed?

I've thought about this off and on for a while.