Beginners program

Fadi said:

Warm up sets depend on more than just one factor. For example, the weather has a role to play in the way you approach your warm up sets. Your age and the state of your connective tissues play yet another important factor. When you're young (generally speaking), you could make bigger jumps in weights without your joints being negatively affected. I don't know your age, but you gave 100kg x10 as an example of best squat. If I was young and the weather was warm, and I was doing sets of 10s, my approach would look something like this: 20kg x5 40kg x5 60kg x3 80kg x3 100kg x10, 10, 10 Why the lower reps leading up to the 10s when the intention is 10 reps? Because a warm up is just that, a warm up and not an energy sapper. If the 3 reps felt in the groove with all joints feeling lubricated as opposed to feeling rusty, then the 80kg is only there to prevent the brain from a shock. What you feel resting on your trapezius would determine the way you conduct your set, as it's about messages sent and received between your brain and your working muscles. If the brain is happy with the load and perceives it to be safe and manageable, it would tell your legs (and your whole body and nervous system) to go ahead and lift it. If on the other hand you increase the weight by more than what your brain perceives to be a safe and manageable weight to lift (say you go from 40kg straight to 100kg), your brain would automatically begin to send negative signals to the rest of your body, telling it, it (the body) is not ready yet, and you'd have great difficulties managing a weight you have done before. So it's all in the approach, beginning with your mind (based on your experience), and the way it helps your brain send the right and /or favourable messages that would facilitate instead of hinder the working sets for you.

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Thanks. Makes sense. Also 120kg X50 is insane.

Thank you gentlemen, you're very kind.

My 2 cents...

Strength needs to be addressed before anything else. When you are new the growth comes anyway. Too any people now are way too connected to party muscles and the core ingredients are missing. In the beginning you should be activating as much of the body as possible with each movement and each session. Once you plateau, then you decide which direction and you adjust your training to suit. Rep ranges should be quite low as this will assist in the progression of strength whilst preserving the form as there are less reps to muck it up. No sets to failure. This teaches form and control.

Most of what is there can stay, but I think there needs to be a couple of those exercises replaced due to a more beneficial alternative. I suggest keeping it simple but hard for the first 12 months and get your body used to the movements and handling the increased weight and work load. Isolation movements are not necessary at this point.

5 x 5 is the best in the beginning. You can all argue as much as you want to about it, but it is easy to follow for a beginner, easy to program for a beginner and it's proven. I also suggest that you seek a lifting coach and get it right in the beginning. Too many movements are dropped by too many lifters for a number of reasons, and usually this stems from the inability to perform it correctly, causing pain and injuries.

A
Squat
Bench
Row (don't care which one, just do it)
Farmers walk (BW)

B
Dead
Press
Pull up
Hanging leg raises (5 x 10 - 15) YRMV but this is where mine respond. If you can't get your feet to your hands then hold the position for 5 seconds at the apex of the movement each rep until your strength improves.

If you feel like you need more than this then you didn't go hard enough. Alternate each time you pick up the bar. Do not use any machines including smith. You will not benefit from the body's need to stabilise, and it is not a natural movement. In the beginning 3 times a week is ideal and it would look like this:
WEEK ONE - A/B/A
WEEK TWO - B/A/B
etc, etc, etc.

You don't have to have 50 exercises. Do the foundation movements hard and correct. Record everything in a journal and hit PB's whether it be weight or reps.

Enjoy.

UPDATE - I have just realised this post did not reply to the particular post it was intended for. I will leave here anyway as hopefully it can be a discussion point. The original post I was replying to was addressing a beginner routine and had included curls and SLDL along with 8 - 10 rep ranges.

^ did you read the whole thread including the results Markos got from the beginners at his gym using this routine back in the day ? Just curious as to why you thought it was broken and needed a fix ?

No, I didn't read the entire 227 pages. Like I said I was replying to the very first post in the thread, but it didn't happen the way I thought it would.
We are specifically talking about beginners here and every movement should have a purpose and should involve as many hinges as possible for greater activation and muscle involvement. Deadlift is absent yet there is a parameter for the lift? How do you track and provide the progression to attain the benchmark? SLDL in it's place. Whilst these may be good for the HS, they do not provide the same level of benefit to a beginner, and foundation is the most important thing here. Get the basics right and then move to the additional movements. Isolation exercises do not belong in a beginner program, especially curls. These should be reserved for someone who has gone through a beginner program and had decided on the direction they are going to take. I feel there are a lot more exercises that provide greater benefit to a beginner than curls. Rep ranges were geared more towards hypertrophy as opposed to strength and in the beginning strength and stability are far more important.
Like I said it was my 2 cents for what it is worth and in my experience 5 rep sets would get me to those numbers if I was a beginner as opposed to 8 rep sets.

Fair enough, but as anyone who has trained for long enough will know there is more than one way to skin a cat (so to speak, I am not advocating actually skining cats ;-) ). The 5 rep approach had been used for a very long time and is a good way to go for many, whether it is optimal had been the subject of many debates and not one I want to start here. But regardless in my opinion effort and consistency are the real sectrets to training success.

Opinions will vary

Indeed they will, that's what makes life interesting

goosey said:

opinions will vary

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ymmv.

Markos program I found to be harder than 5X5 but I found since I prefer 5X5 I would stick to it longer. So I guess the program you stick to the longest is the best..........for you.

Whether a newbie is doing 8s or 5s is relatively inconsequential as long as there is some form of progression over time

^ true dat

One's?

Two's ????

As long as you're not doing number 2s whilst lifting

I think I've managed during the 2 minute rest.

Hi guys,

I am doing a basic 5x5 program. Does anyone have a formula (or experience) to calculate the 1 rep max based on 5x5? I only found one that calculates the 1 rep max based on a single 5 reps, obviously it has to be much more... Approx how many percent of the 1 rep max can one complete 5x5? Thanks in advance.

Second, as a part of the program I do 5x5 DL as well, but some other programs suggest that only 1 x 5 is enough for DL (and 5 x 5 for other exercises) is that true? What is everyone's opinion/view/experience on it? Thanks...

Are you trying to work out what weight to start at or your actual 1RM?

If you've never done a 5x5 before, start off lighter than you think. The first few weeks may seem easy but it's better than stalling a month in to the program.

If you want to know your actual 1RM, then the only real way is to do it. Hypotheticals don't count for much in terms of bragging rights

In Wendlers 5 3 1 program he suggest the following for estimating 1RM but I agree with white lie it is only an estimate and best way to know it to try it.

Weight x Reps x .0333 + Weight = Estimated 1RM

White_Lie said:

Are you trying to work out what weight to start at or your actual 1RM?

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Thanks, no I already started and yes, I started a bit light, no problem with that, I just wanted to estimate how I progress. It's only the third week, so I do not expect PB yet, yes, I will test it again once I feel strong and ready (in 20 years )

Any thoughts on dead lift 5x5? Is it ok? Thanks.