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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Doctor Explains Why Calories in vs Calories Out is a Fallacy.

  1.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Mick View Post
    I don't believe I mentioned Dr Berg, yes he does the interview in one of the videos.

    Just because he is a chiropractor does not mean he has not done further study, clearly Dr Berg is not relying on his chiropractor training to run his nutritional forums.

    Dr Jason Fung is an expert in his field, having cured countless people of ailments, yet you also disregard his advice, yet he does have all the qualifications.

    So is it just that you disregard anyone that does not agree with your world views or is there other criteria you use??


    In his field? He's a Nephrologist. A kidney specialist. He is not a dietician or nutritionalist. He groups everyone under the same banner as those with kidney issues that come thru his clinic.

    Here's another article from someone with the right qualifications.

    https://www.evolvedsportandnutrition...an-a-dietitian

    And here's one pointing out the many flaws Dr Fung has in his posts.
    https://www.myoleanfitness.com/evide...c-restriction/
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    Problem is that calories in vs calories out theory is based on physics, not human physiology. Humans are not machines, most dietary advice ignores this fact.
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    From what I can see, Dr Fungs jacket is very ill fitting, the sleeves are too big for his arms and the bottom just hangs like a curtain.
    Terrible fit.
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  •   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Mick View Post
    Problem is that calories in vs calories out theory is based on physics, not human physiology. Humans are not machines, most dietary advice ignores this fact.
    Yes, your body will adapt to the deficit, hence why you slowly reduce calories in. Then you can drop them again. And again. And again. It's not rocket science Mick...
    If you aren't losing weight, you're not in a deficit. Simple.

    The only reason fasting works for some is because it's easier to limit your calories when you have a smaller window to eat in. You naturally eat less. Nothing to do with insulin levels. If insulin was so important, why doesn't say a keto diet that has very little to no carbs have drastically different weight loss results when overall calories consumed are equal?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunta View Post
    From what I can see, Dr Fungs jacket is very ill fitting, the sleeves are too big for his arms and the bottom just hangs like a curtain.
    Terrible fit.
    I don't even own a suit, and last time I wore one was around 25 years ago. So I can't really comment.
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    Quote Originally Posted by White_Lie View Post
    Yes, your body will adapt to the deficit, hence why you slowly reduce calories in. Then you can drop them again. And again. And again. It's not rocket science Mick...
    If you aren't losing weight, you're not in a deficit. Simple.
    So how long do you keep dropping calories?? This to me seems like the perfect way to stuff your metabolism.

    Quote Originally Posted by White_Lie View Post
    The only reason fasting works for some is because it's easier to limit your calories when you have a smaller window to eat in. You naturally eat less. Nothing to do with insulin levels. If insulin was so important, why doesn't say a keto diet that has very little to no carbs have drastically different weight loss results when overall calories consumed are equal?
    I am pretty certain a well executed ketonic diet has superior weight loss results for most people (over a pure calorie restriction diet). By well executed I mean done correctly, most people following a Keto diet consume excess (too much) protein causing a rise in insulin levels.

    It's basic science and a well known fact that insulin is a fat storage hormone, insulin is what is required for cells to store fat, it is also almost impossible to access your fat stored in the presence of insulin. People keep telling their body to store fat and then wonder why they get fat.

    Some people may get away with just reducing calories, just like some people manage to live off pizza and KFC and still stay lean. However there is a large number of people that will have zero success simply reducing calories, Especillay when they are also weight training and wanting to remain strong and gain muscle.
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  •   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #17
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    You drop maybe 500 cals off your maintenance, then another 200 or so, slowly coming down over weeks as your metabolism adapts (and of course your weight drops so your actual maintenance cals are lower). Many would suggest a refeed after a certain number of weeks to reset the metabolism however, you should only be cutting for maybe 10-15 weeks at a time. If you want to retain maximum muscle mass, it's a slow process. Around 500g loss per week is what you should be aiming for. This isn't the biggest loser...

    Seriously Mick, this is all basic stuff. How long have you been doing this and never been thru a cut or bulk? If you want to lose weight, you consume less. If you want to gain weight, you consume more.

    If cals in/out don't matter, how would you suggest one gain weight? Just pump themselves full of sugar to keep the insulin spiking whilst sticking to maintenance caloric intake?
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    It’s funny calories in vs calories while not 100% perfect works on farm animals extremely well.

    Its harder to work on humans because humans tend to lie and it’s hard to tie humans up for years and do a controlled calories in vs out study.

    Calories in vs out isn’t just pure physics without taking into biology. When you test the energy of feeds for farm animals you have to specify the animal because the feed value varies depending on the animals and how they digest the same feed. Humans is the same. The calories you see is estimated for humans, it’s not the total calorie content of that food.

    There was this TV show that was doing nutrition myths. They got three people that claimed they all ate something like 1500 calories and couldn’t loose weight, calorie counting didn’t work for them. The show hired private investigators to follow them and track their eating. In reality they were actually eating something like double to triple the calories they claimed.


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    A few things about Fung

    He pushes insulin as the main culprit to fat gain, whilst most others contribute calories.

    Fung doesn’t go into the important aspects of building or maintaining muscle whilst killing fat which I believe is most important.

    He has (like most) good and bad points in his book, but I think it would’ve been more helpful and convincing if he had of included before and after pictures of people he’d worked with, if he even has done so.

    Based on that I think there is far more practical evidence to suggest that calories in and out are the best overall measure.
    And like everything if you cannot measure you can’t produce realistic results.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Mick View Post
    .



    I am pretty certain a well executed ketonic diet has superior weight loss results for most people (over a pure calorie restriction diet). By well executed I mean done correctly, most people following a Keto diet consume excess (too much) protein causing a rise in insulin levels.
    .
    No i think it's been found that when caloric deficit is equal, the two methods provided similar results.

    Ill need to go find it.

    Also, the guy who ate nothing but maccas, and another guy who Ate nothing but mars bars. Kept to a caloric deficit. Both lost predictable amounts of weight.

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