• Keep up to date with Ausbb via Twitter and Facebook. Please add us!
  • Join the Ausbb - Australian BodyBuilding forum

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

    The Ausbb - Australian BodyBuilding forum is dedicated to no nonsense muscle and strength building. If you need advice that works, you have come to the right place. This forum focuses on building strength and muscle using the basics. You will also find that the Ausbb- Australian Bodybuilding Forum stresses encouragement and respect. Trolls and name calling are not allowed here. No matter what your personal goals are, you will be given effective advice that produces results.

    Please consider registering. It takes 30 seconds, and will allow you to get the most out of the forum.

G

Banned
Hello,

I rang up a few places regarding buying equipment to have my own home gym (saves me the membership of a Gym and travel time).

After talking with a few places, one of them recommended instead of investing $2000-$3000 in a home Gym, since I am a beginner, I would be better off spending that money on a Personal Trainer. Not just any trainer, as there are a lot of clowns out there. Someone with a reputation to uphold. They might cost a fair bit, but, they could teach me how to do the lifts, the technical side behind the lifts, develop a workout program that would fit me and see me making the gains (Google has 10000000 programs... which one will work for me though? hence the trainer to tailor the needs) and so forth.

Then I have a personal friend of mine who says gym trainers are a waste of money, you can learn on an empty bar how to do all those lifts correctly, so there is no point spending ($150 or so per hour?) on a gym trainer.

What do you guys recommend?

2nd: I am posting here because I am interested in Strength training. When I told my brother I wanna do it, he made a few points why not to bother which is what I want to clarify from those that actually do strength train.

A: He says that at my age, 32, my body is not going to be developing like it would have had I been 18-20 when most of ones strength starts to build. So to do powerlifting or weightlifting now, I am only going to get myself injured and ruin my career (singing).

B: He has a weightlifting friend who has ruined his joints and he claims his friend said that almost all lifters know as they get older there joints are going to stuffed. Considering I am a singer... that is one problem I do not need or want.

C: Don't do lifting because you don't need it as a singer, and it promotes all these risks which can ruin your later stage in life (joints etc), and also not every persons body is suited to that style of training either. So even with a world class coach, there is no guarantee that my body is suited to that style of training, my central nervous system may not respond to that style of method, and again Injury in question, and again, what for? To end my singing career... then I would wish had I never started Gym, I would never have the problems I do.

So the conclusion is: Since Gym is not my 'career' there is no point shortening my actual career due to Gym. It sounds basically like, Gym is a good for now thing (show off, etc) but long term... its actually going to cause damage and not benefit. Damage I don't need as a singer. So I am simply better off without it unless I planned to make it my career and then just reap the consequences later. So basically it has no health (it does short-term) benefits but drawbacks (long term - joint issues, cartilage problems etc).

You can understand what position I am in.

As a singer... it is true, there is no need to lift weights. So if I don't lift them... I will be 100% fine the rest of my life. However I love the idea of lifting and it would be good and feel good to do. However, if this is going to promote long term problems... then later in life I would wish I never have done lifting as at that stage I wouldn't have those problems had I just stuck to my singing.

So some clarification on these points would be appreciated as I am not sure how valid his remarks are... (you know, the I know it all, giving advice on everything in life person problem).
 
Hey mate, I can understand getting told not jumping in to buying a gym setup. Mainly because it can turn in to an expensive clothes rack. If you are already fairly dedicated gym wise, go for it.

Not sure what PT is charging $150 an hour but that is a rip off, getting the movements down pact with someone is a good start to actually not injuring yourself, rather than jumping under a bar and just taking a stab at it.

Your brother sounds like one of them fat people who want to diet yet have every excuse in the book, I wouldn't be listening to him, do this for yourself.

The age thing is a load of crap, yes there will be some negatives but 32 isn't that old, you may need more recovery than someone 10 years younger. You will be going from nothing to actually lifting, you will see results
 
I think you have to be doing everything wrong or lifting a long time intensely / competitively for it to have any negative impacts on you long term. ?
And it sounds like you haven't really started yet?

Isnt 32 still young?!

What do you mean when you refer to strength training/weight lifting/power lifting? Getting fit, competing in meets?
 
Actions verify priorities

there is is enough evidence to suggest that starting a weight lifting program at any age will have huge benefits and in some cases life saving.

do a bit of reading, and if you are serious (which I don't believe you are) do yourself a favor and buy "keys to progress"
 
Hello,

I rang up a few places regarding buying equipment to have my own home gym (saves me the membership of a Gym and travel time).

After talking with a few places, one of them recommended instead of investing $2000-$3000 in a home Gym, since I am a beginner, I would be better off spending that money on a Personal Trainer. Not just any trainer, as there are a lot of clowns out there. Someone with a reputation to uphold. They might cost a fair bit, but, they could teach me how to do the lifts, the technical side behind the lifts, develop a workout program that would fit me and see me making the gains (Google has 10000000 programs... which one will work for me though? hence the trainer to tailor the needs) and so forth.

Then I have a personal friend of mine who says gym trainers are a waste of money, you can learn on an empty bar how to do all those lifts correctly, so there is no point spending ($150 or so per hour?) on a gym trainer.

What do you guys recommend?

2nd: I am posting here because I am interested in Strength training. When I told my brother I wanna do it, he made a few points why not to bother which is what I want to clarify from those that actually do strength train.

A: He says that at my age, 32, my body is not going to be developing like it would have had I been 18-20 when most of ones strength starts to build. So to do powerlifting or weightlifting now, I am only going to get myself injured and ruin my career (singing).

B: He has a weightlifting friend who has ruined his joints and he claims his friend said that almost all lifters know as they get older there joints are going to stuffed. Considering I am a singer... that is one problem I do not need or want.

C: Don't do lifting because you don't need it as a singer, and it promotes all these risks which can ruin your later stage in life (joints etc), and also not every persons body is suited to that style of training either. So even with a world class coach, there is no guarantee that my body is suited to that style of training, my central nervous system may not respond to that style of method, and again Injury in question, and again, what for? To end my singing career... then I would wish had I never started Gym, I would never have the problems I do.

So the conclusion is: Since Gym is not my 'career' there is no point shortening my actual career due to Gym. It sounds basically like, Gym is a good for now thing (show off, etc) but long term... its actually going to cause damage and not benefit. Damage I don't need as a singer. So I am simply better off without it unless I planned to make it my career and then just reap the consequences later. So basically it has no health (it does short-term) benefits but drawbacks (long term - joint issues, cartilage problems etc).

You can understand what position I am in.

As a singer... it is true, there is no need to lift weights. So if I don't lift them... I will be 100% fine the rest of my life. However I love the idea of lifting and it would be good and feel good to do. However, if this is going to promote long term problems... then later in life I would wish I never have done lifting as at that stage I wouldn't have those problems had I just stuck to my singing.

So some clarification on these points would be appreciated as I am not sure how valid his remarks are... (you know, the I know it all, giving advice on everything in life person problem).
You've raised several points which need addressing. Unlike some others on here, I actually believe that you are serious (in your own unique way) about doing what's best for you. Hence, I thought that rather than sit here and advice you about what I believe is right wrong good or bad, I've decided that it'd be better that I empower you in order for you to make your own decisions.

What is your main priority above all else?
 
You've raised several points which need addressing. Unlike some others on here, I actually believe that you are serious (in your own unique way) about doing what's best for you. Hence, I thought that rather than sit here and advice you about what I believe is right wrong good or bad, I've decided that it'd be better that I empower you in order for you to make your own decisions.

What is your main priority above all else?

Everyone tells me I'm unique in some way lol.

Well - My vocal development is my main priority above all else.

In terms of what I want to do in Gym (as I assume that is what you are meaning by priority, just not sure) - it would be to build strength.

I used to think 'size' was everything... but honestly... with my singing (opera), Size is definitely not the aim for me. I always get enjoyment out of putting on a lot on the bar.

I remember years ago before I had an accident and life took a different turn... being in my friends home Gym doing lifting... and I always seemed to wanna add 'more' but that reduced the repetitions from 10 down. I like doing what I actually 'can' rather than 60% of it to lift it 10+ times.

So naturally I gravitate towards strength. I also like the physical look of those who strength train. I do not know if its just me or not... but bodybuilding seems to make an 'inflated' look even if the power lifter is identical size. One just seems to have an appearance of steel compare to the more 'pumped up' look (again, even both were the same size).

So all in all, if these are not mis-nomers, strength would be what I want to do.

I do not know how relevant this is... but if you would... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qySRWjqctok

The guy in the blue shirt. He does not look to me as big as the main speaker (who is a body builder), he is stronger though and to me looks more solid rather than inflated (might be an illusion, maybe muscle density has something to do with it)

"Appearance" wise, that would be all I would care to achieve (if at all I can.. in video it doesn't look very big - to me seems very achievable - but videos can be deceiving, it might be huge, you would know better than me) I think that looks solid/built/healthy/natural.

From the comments made at the start of the video... he is a Powerlifter.

So roughly that size (if its not deceiving in the video) and strong enough...

Shape like that I can imagine on stage singing. Shape like a huge body builder... I can not imagine.

So what do I want... basically that which is strength and 'good' shape (not huge shape), which that video pretty much sums up (at least in concept).

And the other part is, to have that without the drawback of "Well be prepared to wreck your knees, your joints, your cartilage" - which of course, you can imagine... Here I am trying to sing on stage at 50+ and realise my 'younger years' (which is the now) I decided to lift, and here I am now at 50+ with all these 'why do my knees feel sore, why do my elbows feel sore' etc problems.

So yes I am serious about it, yes I want strength, what I don't know is, can I have that without the 'so called' problems that gets branded on the lifters (knee pains elbow pains etc). Because music is my priority... I don't want to do something now that I will later in life regret "Well had I not done gym when I was 32, I wouldn't have these issues and pains now"... this is what I am trying to avoid. I want Gym... I don't want those joint/health problems as I do not need or want them as a singer.

So really I am just trying to make an intelligent decision here. I want Gym... I don't want to ruin myself for my singing (years later after what I do now takes the toll...)

Hence the question and I hope that is understandable.

I never do anything half-assed. So if I am going to go do gym, I'm going to go all out. If going all out will cause me long term problems... then as a singer it may not be the smartest thing to do in which case I need to decide "singing or gym, not both".

I want both, I don't know if I can have both.

That is where I am at.
 
Last edited:
I never do anything half-assed. So if I am going to go do gym, I'm going to go all out. If going all out will cause me long term problems... then as a singer it may not be the smartest thing to do in which case I need to decide "singing or gym, not both".

I want both, I don't know if I can have both.

That is where I am at.
Have you ever followed a structured strength program? I ask because there's no such thing as ...
I never do anything half-assed. So if I am going to go do gym, I'm going to go all out.
What may seem to you as "half-assed", would actually be the smart way of getting stronger. So that makes it a no to the attitude of "I'm going to go all out", if you do choose to go down the gym. I don't know about singing, but I do know that there's a method to training, and if you're prepared to follow it, then you would achieve your strength/size goals, whilst minimising the potential for incurring an injury, when compared to simply training haphazardly.
 
Hello Fadi,

I wouldn't know where to begin regarding the 'strength structured' program. That is exactly why I am here. Had I known all of that, where to get started, how, whether it was safe and so forth... I doubt I would of been here asking the questions.

What did you mean 'there is no such thing as ...' ?

What I meant by half-assed is, skip days I'm not supposed to skip, muck around haphazardly just doing anything, any amount of reps and any kind of exercise with no clear direction as to what I am trying to achieve. Therefor, I might be 'gaining' regardless (compare to never lifting) but at the same time I am wasting my time because nothing is structured to achieve the direction I want to go in.

EG: I can go gym, do 10 reps of squats for 3-4 sets, then do more squats of a different sort, then bench press same thing then incline bench press, then dumbell press, then go to military press same thing, then crank out some tricep exercises (skull crushers with a barbell) or some db extensions, then do some bicep curls, then screw curls, then barbell curls... then decide to hit up some calves and even bentover rows and pullups, all 10 reps of each, maybe 2 sets for some and 3-4 sets for the others, or even better, just keep going until I can't lift anymore even if that is 6 sets.

This is what I mean... half-assed as in doing anything blindly in the gym with no structure set out to achieve the goal desired.

Going all out I simply meant, to do it 100% properly, structured, not mucking around doing stuff I should not of been doing (slowing my progress down), not all out in terms of weight (stupidly) and injuring myself.

Sorry for confusion.
 
Last edited:
It's true that most people will do better with competent instruction than doing everything on their own. You'll know this from your singing: there are a rare few who developed their ability by themselves, but most had some instruction.

You don't need to pay $150ph for a competent trainer. I've no idea where you are, but my garage gym is $500 for 3 months, coming as often as you like during opening hours - and most capital cities have a PTC gym, their fees are usually similar.

My oldest lifter is 73yo, and she is getting stronger and now has less pain than before, not more - osteoarthritis, gout, etc. So I think at 32 you'll be fine.

You don't need to lift to be a better singer, but you do need to lift to be a better and more useful human being. If you don't believe me, go visit a nursing home, they're filled with people who never lifted, and who are now unable to walk and who just sit around wetting their pants. Lifting is nasty on your body if you go stupidly hard. And so we come back to the need for competent instruction.
 
Hello Fadi,

I wouldn't know where to begin regarding the 'strength structured' program. That is exactly why I am here. Had I known all of that, where to get started, how, whether it was safe and so forth... I doubt I would of been here asking the questions.
Please take a look over here Beginners; Look Here! and also check Kyle's ground works as well, as he gives you a link in post #4 of my thread above. Thank you.
 
I had forgotten that, Fadi, it being more than five years ago. It's actually not bad. Someone coming to train with me I'd have them progress faster, but nothing awful would happen to a person if they did all that on their own, it would be a not bad foundation.
 
Please take a look over here
Beginners; Look Here! and also check Kyle's ground works as well, as he gives you a link in post #4 of my thread above. Thank you.


Hello,

I had a look at that link provided...

There seems to be 4 different options. Marko's one... Fadi's one (the 2 links provided)... then:

A. Squats
B. Bench press
C. Dead lift
D. One arm d/bell rows
E. D/bell presses or B/bell military presses.

All done at 3 sets for between 8-10 reps. Aim to increase your weights by 2.5% each week and do this program for 3 months solid before contemplating a change.

Then mark rippetoe Workout A and B...

Can I have little clarification?

What of those options should I be doing given what I have already said? Or is the point to that, to say, do any one of the 4 it is irrelevant right now which... ?


 
Last edited:
G-man, just go to a gym with a competent trainer. You don't need options right now, you just need to start and go on with it. It works best with an instructor, believe me. Glance over some old threads here, then see how few people ever come back to report on their success.
 
Pay for 6 months in a proper gym with proper coaching.

It will be better and cheaper than buying equipment and fumbling around on your own and you will quickly find your ideal programming and commitment levels.
 
Hey, My friend told me to come to his Gym which is about as far to his place as it is the closest public Gym.

He has lifted weights (on and off) for 30 years, so he knows how to/not to lift (form etc) (I assume he does, he has been a gym fanatic for ages and worked out with many pro's over the years).

Uhm...

I thought of an exercise based on the reading Fadi gave...

Just want to check with you guys if I can do that or whether Im trying to take what was designed for 1 workout and apply to another which may not work.

I took the rippetoe reps, the powerlifting beginners add 2.5% per week aspect and a 3rd routine and made a program for myself out of all 3.

So essentially what I have come up with is...

Squats 3x5
Bench Press 3x5
Dead lift 3x5
Bent Over Rows 3x5
Shoulder Press 3x5

All done 3 times per week (maybe twice a week? depending on how much thats gonna take out of me), all done with a barbell, and try to add 2.5% weight every week over 3 months.

By end of 3 months, strength should have increased 32.5% to where it was before.

So If I started with 20kg on Bench press, it should be at 26.5kg by end of 3 months (32.5% strength increase).

Does this sound like it would work?

My friend can show me how to do these properly. I mean.. shoulder press is straight forward stick bar behind neck and lift straight up. Arms usually at 90 degree (to elbow and up to bar) L shape.

Bent over row keep back straight, not hunched over, bend down with knees. Same with deadlift. Squats, bar behind neck (like shoulder press) then bend at knees, back stays straight throughout... get bum slightly lower than knees before lifting up). Bench press, L shape again, bring bar to chest and straight up.

To what I have seen, all of them are done with a L shaped type arm position, its not wide grip where arms are going away from elbow, nor in pointing towards eachother, but L shaped.

On line they make it sound so 'technical' while what i just said sounds too simple.

Any corrections are welcome!

Thanks guys
 
Last edited:
Hey,

I am just trying to understand what the 'coach' will be doing for me.

If the program I set out is ok. If the way I suggested it be lifted is fine. Then Coach will have nothing to do with 'how to lift'. If he isn't going to be helping with that, what is he there for?

If I am lifting all correctly, how is the 'coach' going to help me lift more/shorter period of time, if I am already doing it all right to begin with? (As said, my friend can keep an eye on me if my back is out or something like that) -

So whats the coach for?

I only ask this, is because a friend of mine who lives in Melbourne, is going into competative body building. He has never had a coach, and he looks better than most people. He just works out smart and has done it for many years. I remember how big he was (6 foot at 55kg) back years ago when he lived here. Now he is 95kg, 8% Body fat, no coach.

I mean... he is the one saying no point to one (based on his own results).

Everyone here is advocating "Get a coach" - If I know how to do the lifts "Get a coach" - Ok so naturally my question is "What is the coach for then if it is not for the lifts sake?"
 
Did you learn to sing by yourself without a teacher?

I'm not spruiking for business, I wouldn't train you. Too much questioning, not enough lifting. But someone should train you.
 
[MENTION=18604]G-man[/MENTION] you asked advice and thats the vote I guess. If you dont want to then dont have to
 
Did you learn to sing by yourself without a teacher?
I'm not spruiking for business, I wouldn't train you. Too much questioning, not enough lifting. But someone should train you.

I never asked to be trained by you nor anything to do with business.

So where that comment comes from, no idea.

As far as "too many questions not enough lifting" - Sorry but if someone tells me to do squats with a bent back, "nah dont ask questions just lift" you serious? That would make you disqualified as any competent trainer to begin with.

I need to know what a trainer will do for me (besides the lifts - since I have someone that can show me that). I mentioned I can do the lifts properly, it was stated "get a coach".

Well that means the coach is for more reasons than just 'lifting'. That is what I need to know so I do not end up with a joker.

In any business - the customer/client needs to know what he is getting, what to look for, so he doesn't end up in the wrong hands.

Just like singing - I asked all the questions, thats why I ended up with the right coach. Had I not asked, and just did "too many questions not enough lifting" - I would of ruined my voice with someone who thinks he is a coach but in reality is not.
 
Last edited:
Top