BCAA's

Davepuppies said:

…., I strictly use BCAA post workout, as Luke McNally told me the MTor pathway gets blunted by constant BCAA consumption during the day, but in one big load once a day it is most effective.

Click to expand...

Where does does BroScience come from??? Do you know what BCAA's are(other than the BS spiel on the glossy label of your BCAA supplement)??

Do you know that pretty much all meat sources and protein sources contain BCAA's, this includes fish, steak, pork, eggs, chicken etc etc and that with normal eating your body gets BCAA's all day long and all night long, even without buying overpriced supplemental BCAA's which actually do nothing and just get pissed out, unless you have not had any protein for a few days.

If you get your standard 1 to 1.5 grams of protein per kilo of body weight each day, BCAA's have zero benefit, and may actually put extra strain on your kidneys as they have to process all this un needed stuff so you can piss it down the toilet.

Some Fun BCAA Facts:

Dry roasted peanuts gram for gram contain more BCAA's than any other source.

100gram serving of any meat/fish/peanuts will give you a full serving of BCAA's.

If you have consumed 200-300grams of either meat, fish, eggs, peanuts, protein powder during the day any BCAA supplements will be pissed out. Keep in mind that 100grams of any meat/fish/eggs/peanuts/protein powder/milk etc will give you a full serving of BCAA's. So if you consume a total of 500 grams of any of the above (which most here would naturally) you are roughly getting 5 servings of BCAA's throughout your day already prior to adding any supplements.

All Protein shakes naturally contain BCAA's without having to add any.

Adding BCAA's will throw out the natural balance of the protein, as the amino acid ratio will be wrong.

I don't think anyone is claiming to be BCAA deficient or worried they aren't getting enough. If they were, like you said, just have regular protein. What most people don't consider when it comes to supplements are the hormonal effects they have on the body. Unlike protein powders, most supplement aren't simply food replacements used to fill up your macros. Their consumption is just as important as the timing.

With BCAAs, it's generally accepted that the best time to take them is pre or intra workout. Consuming amino acids suppresses cortisol, a stress hormone that breaks down your body and uses tissue for energy. The greatest risk of this happening is during your workout. They can also be used during fasting phases where you body will have to use protein and fat stores as fuel.

steveP said:

I don't think anyone is claiming to be BCAA deficient or worried they aren't getting enough. If they were, like you said, just have regular protein. What most people don't consider when it comes to supplements are the hormonal effects they have on the body. Unlike protein powders, most supplement aren't simply food replacements used to fill up your macros. Their consumption is just as important as the timing.

With BCAAs, it's generally accepted that the best time to take them is pre or intra workout. Consuming amino acids suppresses cortisol, a stress hormone that breaks down your body and uses tissue for energy. The greatest risk of this happening is during your workout. They can also be used during fasting phases where you body will have to use protein and fat stores as fuel.

Click to expand...

My response was mainly for Davepuppies, where he suggested someone advised him not to consume and BCAA"s throughout the day, I mainly tried to explain to him that he already consumes BCAA's all day long.

To some degree what you say is correct, but all this only applies if you have not eaten for 3-4 days prior to training, if you had dinner the night before training, or breakfast and lunch throughout he day for those training at night or afternoons none of this applies. There will be plenty of everything in your body.

I don't think you give millions of years of evolution enough credit, if you started running short of BCAA's after a short little workout that may last from 40 minutes to 2 hrs depending on person and program, I think humans as a species would have died out millions of years ago.

Recommended daily dosage for BCAA's is somewhere between 68mg/kg body weight and 80mg/kg body weight….. read and understand that, that translates to 6.8 grams - 8 grams per day for a 100kg person, which is equal to the amount of BCAA's in about 120-150grams of meat or fish or peanuts. So if you consume 200grams of any protein source you are getting more than enough BCAA's to not be running out during a workout in the gym or the rest of the day.

All sturdies that show any benefits of BCAA's are always done with FASTED subjects, and you can give a spoon full of sugar or a Tim Tam biscuit to a fasted subject and it will show up a performance increase after consuming it, so it's flawed broscience.

Here is some interesting reading, shows just how minor any POSSIBLE benefits you MAY have:

Branched Chain Amino Acids - Scientific Review on Usage, Dosage, Side Effects | Examine.com

Big Mick said:

I don't think you give millions of years of evolution enough credit, if you started running short of BCAA's after a short little workout that may last from 40 minutes to 2 hrs depending on person and program, I think humans as a species would have died out millions of years ago.

Click to expand...

Millions of years of evolution didn't turn us into bodybuilders. It's actually quite unnatural to have large masses of muscle with relatively low body fat. It's inefficient, requires more energy to sustain and is dead weight unless moving something heavy. Following bodybuilding training and nutrition pretty much goes against evolution and your body is constantly fighting to get back to a more efficient form. So you need all these tricks and tips to continuously build muscle.

1. Why would you dig up a post made several weeks ago now?

2. I will trust Luke, who gets national level competitions ready all year, over you

3. Yes I am aware what BCAAs are. Food contains many different amino acids.

4. I consume the BCAAS for the reason Steve has alluded to above, cortisol, insulin response and increased protein synthesis immediately after training. Mtor.

5. Let your physique do the talking

Your turn big mick

Davepuppies said:

View attachment 10860

Your turn big mick

Click to expand...

[emoji106]

am very jealous of your traps puppies!

C_T said:

am very jealous of your traps puppies!

Click to expand...

They are a pain in the arse..... They take over everything unless I am super dillegent and have perfect form. Especially bicep work. I haven't trained them at all the last few months, to try and balance things out a bit.

I wouldn't mind having that problem..haha

Traps too big... Wish I knew dem feels

I use EAA's. Has all the BCAA's as well as the other essential amino's.

It's the old supplements saga.

No supplement is ever essential. None. You can be strong, big, healthy and ripped without (kneel, then genuflect towards the GNC store) any supplements at all.

If you think that Ronnie Coleman got to where he did because of his supplements, you are prime marketing fodder.

Yes, they can fill little gaps, make up for missing a proper meal due to work or being busy in general. They can also come in handy if you are on an extreme diet (usually a cutting diet) to provide vitamins and minerals you would otherwise miss out on.

But in general you will get big and ripped by doing the following:

Eat unprocessed whole foods to complement your chosen diet, mostly protein and fat with green stuff.
Train hard and heavy until you can barely move.
Sleep for 8-10 hours per day.
Drink lots and lots of water.

There is no magical 60 minute anabolic window. Unless you have literally starved yourself while performing 3 hour intense workouts for a month you will never get anywhere close to "depleting all mah glycogen bro". If you ate a "proper" meal 2 hours prior to a workout then everything you need is already circulating in your blood stream with more to come in your stomach.

Having said that, if you think something is making you big and strong and all dat dere bro stuff, it probably is. Because you mind is one powerful muddafukka.

Do you need BCAA's? No. Can you take them? Yes. Will it help? Maybe, depending on all the other more important factors.

I take supplements. Quite a few right now, often though I use very little. I am taking some BN liver complex, not because I must but because my past history (many years back) of hepatitis means I have a liver weakness and I want to protect it. Does it work? Who knows. But I am happy taking it. Same for joint support supps, protein powder for those missed meals or to put on my cottage cheese for taste and an extra protein boost. Vitamin supp cos, well, I would rather piss out what I don't need than not have enough of something. Oh, and greens powder, cos it was free. Thanks BN.

Bodybuilders and such tend to have extreme attitudes towards diet and are easy fodder for the less scrupulous supps companies. You know, like convincing people that if they don't drink Gatorade with all that sugar and salt they might die running along the beach. We also all tend to have a subconscious conviction that there is a magic pill out there that will make our dreams come true. In reality, its just good diet and hard work.

i think it totally depends on your diet and goals.

if your cutting, and dropping carbs, then having amino's flow during fasted workouts could very well save you important muscle.

if your eating every 2-3hrs then it may be a totally different scenario.

WoodyAllen said:

But in general you will get big and ripped by doing the following:

Eat unprocessed whole foods to complement your chosen diet, mostly protein and fat with green stuff.
Train hard and heavy until you can barely move.
Sleep for 8-10 hours per day.
Drink lots and lots of water.

Click to expand...

This probably sums it up perfectly.

C_T said:

i think it totally depends on your diet and goals.

if your cutting, and dropping carbs, then having amino's flow during fasted workouts could very well save you important muscle.

if your eating every 2-3hrs then it may be a totally different scenario.

Click to expand...

You have a lot more than 2-3 hours, any studies showing BCAA"s having any affect have fasted subjects.

If you are dropping carbs it will have NO effect on your BCAA's, as carbs do not contain BCAA's, most people who cut carbs will eat more proteins as such making BCAA's even less important, as you will have more than enough going through your body. I doubt anyone here has ever performed a 'fasted' workout, 'fasted' would be 24 - 48hrs of consuming no food prior to your workout, if you have eaten in the last 6-12 hrs you will have all the nutrients you need for even the most gruelling workout.

There could be a very small amount of people who could get some benefits, may be vegetarian body builder

I mean you can eat all the BCAA's you like, if it makes you feel better, but it's not going to make any difference to your gainz bro.

Big Mick said:

This probably sums it up perfectly.

Click to expand...

Sorry Mick, I don't see your pic attached? Conveniently forgot?

if you are going to go out of your way to highlight a post I made ages ago, then make a new thread to challenge my beliefs and those of others who have actual credentials, for no reason you need to put up, or shut up.

You had no reason to create this thread, you could have simply commented in the actual original thread.

Davepuppies said:

Sorry Mick, I don't see your pic attached? Conveniently forgot?

if you are going to go out of your way to highlight a post I made ages ago, then make a new thread to challenge my beliefs and those of others who have actual credentials, for no reason you need to put up, or shut up.

You had no reason to create this thread, you could have simply commented in the actual original thread.

Click to expand...

OK lets address your problems:

1) Not 100% sure how my picture is relevant?? How does my picture affect how your body uses BCAA's?? So I am guessing any nutritionist that has spend a lifetime studying nutrition is unable to give advice unless he takes up training and gets bigger than you?? Makes no sense, a few weeks ago you posted a comment and you did not know that milk is made up mostly of water, something most 7 year olds would know, so how did you get that big without knowing something most primary school kids know??

2) I did not start this thread, I commented in the original post, I am guessing one of the moderators must have thought it would make a worth while thread, so I am guessing they took the post and made this thread out of it.

3) What actual credentials do they have, they are telling you not to consume BCAA's throughout the day, so what do you eat all day long?? Obviously no eggs, protein, meat, fish etc as they all contain BCAA's, so clearly who ever told you this has no understanding of nutrition, food and what this food consists of and is just sprouting broscience BS.

4) Please post up what you eat all day long to avoid BCAA's to stop your 'pathways get blunted by constant BCAA consumption during the day' LOL

Big Mick said:

OK lets address your problems:

1) Not 100% sure how my picture is relevant?? How does my picture affect how your body uses BCAA's?? So I am guessing any nutritionist that has spend a lifetime studying nutrition is unable to give advice unless he takes up training and gets bigger than you?? Makes no sense, a few weeks ago you posted a comment and you did not know that milk is made up mostly of water, something most 7 year olds would know, so how did you get that big without knowing something most primary school kids know.

2) I did not start this thread, I commented in the original post, I am guessing one of the moderators must have thought it would make a worth while thread, so I am guessing they took the post and made this thread out of it.

2) What actual credentials do they have, they are telling you not to consume BCAA's throughout the day, so what do you eat all day long?? Obviously no eggs, protein, meat, fish etc as they all contain BCAA's, so clearly who ever told you this has no understanding of nutrition, food and what this food consists of and is just sprouting broscience BS. Pleas post up what you eat all day long to avoid BCAA's to stop your

Click to expand...

Looks like you started the thread to me, if you didn't and the mods have made it a new one, then I have less of a issue. Mods can you confirm?

you then tagged me, in what looks like a new thread you created.

big mick, you are full of advice, talk the talk, but I am willing to bet you have never walked the walk.

luke McNally has more credentials than any other bodybuilding prep coach in Australia that I know of, so I will listen to him.

Do you have in depth knowledge on MTor big mick?