True Protein PRE and POST

@BigMick based on what your saying are you going to be spreading this message on every supplement review posted on the forum? Seems funny to me as you requested protein samples a few months ago from us (we sent you 1 or 2kg if I remember right) and put up a good review on this very same forum knowing our prices before you requested them. Not everyone has time to consume 300g of protein a day in wholefoods hence why people turn to supplements to assist in getting to those levels. We've never mentioned any of those "buzz word" phrases that you put up so I don't see how that is relevant. If we wanted to do that we would of just put out a 5g serve pre workout with 4g of stimulants and hyped it up as a magic pill.

With our pricing, there will be cheaper companies and more expensive companies and you lot have to make the decision on what works for you. If you consider protein as protein and there being no variations then just price shop for the cheapest, but coming from someone who trialled every different raw whey protein available in the development process of this brand I can assure you that there are subtle differences between every manufacturer. I personally use NZ because it mixes better then any other protein I've used and has little to no aftertaste. From what I know NZ whey is considered superior as they have stricter laws regarding the processes in what it's made. Our prices reflect the prices we pay for raw materials and it's really that simple. We also offer a value AUS protein range to cater to people on a budget.

Natural WPC is on special @$17.95 as we overcomitted in the particular line. This offer is likely to come down by Friday at the very latest.

JUST.BLAISE said:

With our pricing, there will be cheaper companies and more expensive companies and you lot have to make the decision on what works for you.

Click to expand...

So your Protein works better?

JUST.BLAISE said:

From what I know NZ whey is considered superior as they have stricter laws regarding the processes in what it's made.

Click to expand...

I'll defer to an industry expert on ^this. [MENTION=6722]Bazza20[/MENTION];

Big Mick said:

No offence but I have read some of your posts and it comes through that you really have no idea what BCAA's are apart what is printed on the glossy label of your supplements, all complete proteins contain BCAA's, 150 grams of chicken or beef will cover your daily BCAA's requirements, so if you have about 150-250 grams total of either beef, chicken, tuna, salmon etc your daily BCAA intake is MORE THAN covered for the day, the rest will be pissed out, even 120 grams of peanuts contain more BCAA's than the post workout shake, all meat you eat also contains creatine in the correct proportion.

Going back to getting your 5 grams of BCAA's, 100grams of most meats will cover it, 100 grams of beef are about 250 calories, just over 5 grams of BCAA's and 25 grams of quality unprocessed complete protein, while your shake will have the same amount of BCAA's, similar calories and less protein, and cost about 5 times the price of my steak and all without the sugar.

While your paying $49 for your 1kg of supplement I can buy 1kg of steak (food) in bulk for about $7-9 per kilo.

Click to expand...

Based on reading your posts, you seem disgruntled at any and all supplements because they haven't worked for you. You seem to over simplify everything and if it doesn't work for you, it won't work for anyone.

Of course all whole food meats contain proteins, but supplementation is used to dial in your macros and for convenience. I'm not going to store half a chicken breast and rice cakes in my gym bag all day. Plus, some of us get sick of chicken/beef/fish for every meal of the day.

The other benefit you seem to ignore, or maybe it's ignorance is absorption and hormone response. WPI straight after a workout will be absorbed rapidly and prevent the body going catabolic after breaking muscle tissue down. The sooner you start giving your muscles what they need, the longer the recovery time. BCAAs are metabolised in the muscle, not the liver. So by the time your body breaks down and digests a chicken breast to extract the BCAAs, hours could have passed.

And the main benefit of a BCAA supplement is that it suppresses cortisol and keeps the body anabolic with basically zero calories.

It's clear that you have a chip on your shoulder about being misinformed about supplements and wasting a lot of money. Since removing them from the diet have your results improved?

steveP said:

Based on reading your posts, you seem disgruntled at any and all supplements because they haven't worked for you. You seem to over simplify everything and if it doesn't work for you, it won't work for anyone.

Of course all whole food meats contain proteins, but supplementation is used to dial in your macros and for convenience. I'm not going to store half a chicken breast and rice cakes in my gym bag all day. Plus, some of us get sick of chicken/beef/fish for every meal of the day.

The other benefit you seem to ignore, or maybe it's ignorance is absorption and hormone response. WPI straight after a workout will be absorbed rapidly and prevent the body going catabolic after breaking muscle tissue down. The sooner you start giving your muscles what they need, the longer the recovery time. BCAAs are metabolised in the muscle, not the liver. So by the time your body breaks down and digests a chicken breast to extract the BCAAs, hours could have passed.

And the main benefit of a BCAA supplement is that it suppressed cortisol and keeps the body anabolic with basically zero calories.

It's clear that you have a chip on your shoulder about being misinformed about supplements and wasting a lot of money. Since removing them from the diet have your results improved?

Click to expand...

The problem with the fast absorption theory is if you have eaten some time in that day you will already have plenty of nutrients readily available for your body to use.

Then the other side of it is that eating 10 min or 2 hours or 5 hours after exercise doesn't seem to make a difference either.

If you are eating a high protein diet you already have more than enough BCAAs.

Talking post workout, your muscle glycogen will be depleted and your body will be releasing cortisol. Your body will eventually replace the muscle glycogen by what's in the liver or food you will inevitably eat. But this takes time and means you're in a catabolic state for longer. And as I said, the sooner you fuel your muscles post workout, the longer you make the recovery time.

steveP said:

Talking post workout, your muscle glycogen will be depleted and your body will be releasing cortisol. Your body will eventually replace the muscle glycogen by what's in the liver or food you will inevitably eat. But this takes time and means you're in a catabolic state for longer. And as I said, the sooner you fuel your muscles post workout, the longer you make the recovery time.

Click to expand...

Sorry no. Maybe you would be right if you hadn't eaten for 3 days prior, but if you have eaten a meal that day there is plenty of nutrients ready to go.

Unless you have done a full on marathon 3 hour session after a long fast you haven't depleted all the glycogen and other nutrients in your muscles.

Basically unless you haven't eaten for days the anabolic window is a load of shit


Stop falling for the glossy supp advertising.

I don't see why everything has to be one extreme or the other. Just because you're not a 3-day carb depleted marathon runner doesn't mean you can't benefit from nutrient timing. You may not see the same exaggerated effects, but there will be an effect. You don't need to completely deplete your body of glycogen either to feel the effects of carbs pre and post workout.

Maybe it's because we're all keyboard nutritionists here, but I never see anyone discuss hormone response. I guess they don't teach that in Bro Science Academy. People smarter than all of us here use and get results from using nutrient timing to control hormone response around training and non training times. I tend to listen to people who know what they are talking about and back it up with results.

Any links on this hormone response that you speak of? I am curious and want to be aware.. full srs.

Jungman said:

Any links on this hormone response that you speak of? I am curious and want to be aware.. full srs.

Click to expand...

Some reading.
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/pierce34.htm

Just for reference. BB.com isn't a scientific journal.

Most of their articles are about toilet paper standard.

Steve, I like the way you think into things I find myself agreeing with the majority of your posts. However, I think you over think things sometimes, I've been bodybuilding for less than a year so this hardy qualifies me. I know as natural body builders which must get as much advantage as possible to grow. We could go into days about all the tips and tricks there are with nutrient timing, hormones, foods, etc. Which there are quite a few. You can keep things simple and gain nice muscle. However, this is not the post to talk about it.

Lets get back on topic!

TRUE PROTEIN PRE AND POST REVIEWS!

steveP said:

Since removing them from the diet have your results improved?

Click to expand...

Like I said no difference at all, zero zilch nothing, apart for having a heap more $$$ in my wallet every months.

It's easy to do try it yourself, get rid of all supps for a month or two and see if it they made any difference at all, it's not really difficult to work out.

To those saying they don't have enough time to consume enough protein, really??? How long does it take to eat two or three meals a day??

Sadly I have to agree with Bazza on this topic, the body will not know the difference where the protein comes from, and how much it cost, it only sees nutrients.

Big Mick said:

the body will not know the difference where the protein comes from, and how much it cost, it only sees nutrients.

Click to expand...

same with the carbohydrates in the mix I'd of thought.

JUST.BLAISE said:

@BigMick based on what your saying are you going to be spreading this message on every supplement review posted on the forum? Seems funny to me as you requested protein samples a few months ago from us (we sent you 1 or 2kg if I remember right) and put up a good review on this very same forum knowing our prices before you requested them.

Click to expand...

I tried your protein and it is one of the better tasting ones IMO, but that is in no way related to this product. I consider myself un-bias, and I recall this was the reason you send me the test samples.

The samples were protein, protein is food, and can be used for convenience, but 392grams of protein with a $1 worth of sugar selling for $50…no thanks.

I probably have not had a protein shake since I reviewed your last sample, personally I have had a shakes, and I have not had them and noted no difference, the best use I have ever found for a shake was to have one just before going to bed, stopped me waking up hungry during the night.

I don't understand this "waking up hungry during the night".
Unless you haven't eaten for 12 hrs how can you be hungry. If you did wake up all you should be thinking about is going back to sleep to release dat der growth hormones not blunting it with food. Too sleepy to worry about food. also.

Never woken up hungry in my life.

Bazza20 said:

Just for reference. BB.com isn't a scientific journal.

Most of their articles are about toilet paper standard.

Click to expand...

There are many, many articles based on studies out there. The link I posted I thought was well written. It also references studies to back up the paper. Which studies do you disagree with?

Puggy said:

Steve, I like the way you think into things I find myself agreeing with the majority of your posts. However, I think you over think things sometimes, I've been bodybuilding for less than a year so this hardy qualifies me. I know as natural body builders which must get as much advantage as possible to grow. We could go into days about all the tips and tricks there are with nutrient timing, hormones, foods, etc. Which there are quite a few. You can keep things simple and gain nice muscle. However, this is not the post to talk about it.

Click to expand...

I agree, I do over think some things too much and I get a bit OCD lol. Like you said, you need to get the basics right first before you see any benefit from nutrient timing. It's like trying to use a fat burner when you're not in a calorie deficit.

However, when you do have the basics sorted out, there are things like controlling hormone response that will fine tune your results and get you those 1-2%ers.

Big Mick said:

Like I said no difference at all, zero zilch nothing, apart for having a heap more $$$ in my wallet every months.

It's easy to do try it yourself, get rid of all supps for a month or two and see if it they made any difference at all, it's not really difficult to work out.

Click to expand...

So you're saying you didn't get better results when removing supplements and going back to 100% whole foods. I see that as a false negative. That doesn't prove that supplements don't work, but that there are some serious holes in your diet that you need to correct first.

The reason I'm so pro-sups is because I didn't use them for many years when I began training. And I saw little to no results. I spent years going in circles, not really understanding why the gym wasn't working for me.
Slowly but surely I started adding in supplements and I got results. I now look back in hindsight and wish I got my diet and supplements sorted out earlier.

So to tell everyone that no one benefits from supplements is irresponsible in my opinion. I could look back to when I started training and say that diet alone doesn't work for anyone because it did very little for me. It's a stupid argument.

steveP said:

I agree, I do over think some things too much and I get a bit OCD lol. Like you said, you need to get the basics right first before you see any benefit from nutrient timing. It's like trying to use a fat burner when you're not in a calorie deficit.

However, when you do have the basics sorted out, there are things like controlling hormone response that will fine tune your results and get you those 1-2%ers.

Click to expand...

Trust me, I love science and getting down to the nuts and bolts of things, some people just don't like hearing about it all, because for a lot of people it can be just as simple as that for them to get results or feel like they are accomplishing something. I'm sort of in between those two people.

I scienctific article rather than some of that bodybuilding.com rubbish would have me interested for sure.
That being said there are some insightful articles on body building com with insightful info.

Supplements do help, I can't believe any one would say other wise.
Hell yes, I get 230g of protein from whole foods, but a tasty, sweet protein shake with 24g of protein at the end of the day is great, not only to help my cravings but push me of 250g of protein.

That being said these are not the types of supplements I rely on to help me train.
Well dosed preworkouts, stimulants will no doubt improve your workout quality, as well as your general energy in conjunction with calorie surplus'. I train a lot harder with preworkout, improved pump, better mind muscle contraction, etc.

I'm not saying go crazy with your dollars and buy shit loads of BCAAs and crap which can help, but you can get most of it from your food. But putting all supplements under the same banner is just stupid.