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Do you train to failure on every set, or just the last set of an exercise?

Darkoz said:
Going to momentary muscular fatigue doesn't necessarily mean you can't complete the rep however, you would know that attempting another rep beyond that last one would not be possible.
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Don't call that to failure, as you completed the last rep you did, it's only failure if you FAIL to complete it.
 
Big Mick said:
Don't call that to failure, as you completed the last rep you did, it's only failure if you FAIL to complete it.
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No not really because you still don't have a rep left in the tank
But it's obvious that our interpretation of the meaning is different
 
solarbear said:
I am in the Wendler/Carter camp. Sub-max training.
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Carter goes to concentric failure and misses reps all the time
He spouts bullshit on how you should train, doesn't get stronger and calls it base building then doesn't follow his own advice
 
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Personally I like to go to concentric failure every set except warm-ups but won't miss reps
I keep the rest periods very short so can always rest longer if needed
Only exception is calves that I take to eccentric failure
 
0ni said:
Carter goes to concentric failure and misses reps all the time
He spouts bullshit on how you should train, doesn't get stronger and calls it base building then doesn't follow his own advice
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I don't give a rats ass what other people do or don't do. I know what works for me and submax training is working awesome. I follow Carter's Blog, mostly cause I think he is kinda funny, and don't see too many failed sets. His real work are some big ass back off sets.

Like Big Mick I leave a rep in the tank. Failing only leads to more failure.

Its not the only way to work out. I also had good success with Westside for Skinny Bastards, going to failure all the time, but I was suffering a lot of unnecessary injuries.

After working out both ways, I find sub max training to be very effective.
 
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Darkoz said:
No not really because you still don't have a rep left in the tank
But it's obvious that our interpretation of the meaning is different
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Yes to me failure is in the definition of the word ie fail to complete the rep, I go to the limit almost every workout, on the last set only as per 5/3/1 templete, but I always complete the last rep, if I feel that is the end I will not attempt another one as I am not interested in failing to complete a rep.

0ni said:
?.... but won't miss reps
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This is the key I believe. Complete the last rep.

solarbear said:
Like Big Mick I leave a rep in the tank. Failing only leads to more failure.

Its not the only way to work out.
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This is my thinking. Need to practice to complete the rep, not to fail to complete it.

Some people like training to failure, but not interested in it.
 
solarbear said:
I don't give a rats ass what other people do or don't do. I know what works for me and submax training is working awesome. I follow Carter's Blog, mostly cause I think he is kinda funny, and don't see too many failed sets. His real work are some big ass back off sets.

Like Big Mick I leave a rep in the tank. Failing only leads to more failure.

Its not the only way to work out. I also had good success with Westside for Skinny Bastards, going to failure all the time, but I was suffering a lot of unnecessary injuries.

After working out both ways, I find sub max training to be very effective.
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He is always posting "half reps" in his training log lol.
I don't give a fuck if what you're doing works for you, I wasn't even talking about you
 
I hate programs that tell you to stop 1 or 2 reps from failure. I hate the grey area of it. I like programs that have a set number of reps you need to hit, no more, no less. Or just go to all out failure. Requires no thinking, just lifting.
 
Same - these days I just try ramp up with say 2 warm up sets of roughly 25-50% and 50% of my target weight, then 1-2 sets working sets.
 
0ni said:
He is always posting "half reps" in his training log lol.
I don't give a fuck if what you're doing works for you, I wasn't even talking about you
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Then why bother to reply?

I replied to the thread, which asked what I did, and then you jump in and want to argue Semantics of what Wendler or Carter do. In the programs they design and sell, they advocate sub max training, that is what I do.

I don't see why you feel the need to try and argue over meaningless crap. I guess somehow 7000+ posts, mostly trolling btw, on a meaningless forum gives you some sense of accomplishment. Pretty sad really.
 
If ones reaches total *fatigue in one set (work set) is there really any point doing two?

*this is to a point where you are unable to move the weight on your own, and to then push for a further rep.

I mean, if you have completely exhausted your muscles strength rested long enough to replenish 90% is it of any value from a muscle building pov?
 
solarbear said:
Then why bother to reply?

I replied to the thread, which asked what I did, and then you jump in and want to argue Semantics of what Wendler or Carter do. In the programs they design and sell, they advocate sub max training, that is what I do.

I don't see why you feel the need to try and argue over meaningless crap. I guess somehow 7000+ posts, mostly trolling btw, on a meaningless forum gives you some sense of accomplishment. Pretty sad really.
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Because I can
 
Silverback said:
If ones reaches total *fatigue in one set (work set) is there really any point doing two?

*this is to a point where you are unable to move the weight on your own, and to then push for a further rep.

I mean, if you have completely exhausted your muscles strength rested long enough to replenish 90% is it of any value from a muscle building pov?
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Is it failure or the time under tension or is it time under tension AND to failure that will make you grow?
 
judgey said:
Is it failure or the time under tension or is it time under tension AND to failure that will make you grow?
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Failure;
It's controversial, there is no evidence to support either, there is no way of measuring the point where muscle receives the right amount of stimulus to grow, in a set of 1 to 10, 10 being the point where you can no longer lift, is the 8th rep?, is it the 9th?

Going to the point of failure ensures you have done everything possible to permit growth, to stimulate growth.

There is one group that says training to failure, teaches failure.
if training your athletes to muscular failure is teaching them to fail then perhaps stopping your athletes short of muscle fatigue is teaching them to quit.

Time under tension is a method of performing reps under time rather than counting reps, most trainees can perform an exercise in 90 seconds using a 2/4 second cadence.

If you stop short of 90, the weight is too heavy, if you can perform the exercise past 90, it's too light, and weight needs to be added.
 
Silverback said:
Failure;
It's controversial, there is no evidence to support either, there is no way of measuring the point where muscle receives the right amount of stimulus to grow, in a set of 1 to 10, 10 being the point where you can no longer lift, is the 8th rep?, is it the 9th?

Going to the point of failure ensures you have done everything possible to permit growth, to stimulate growth.

There is one group that says training to failure, teaches failure.
if training your athletes to muscular failure is teaching them to fail then perhaps stopping your athletes short of muscle fatigue is teaching them to quit.

Time under tension is a method of performing reps under time rather than counting reps, most trainees can perform an exercise in 90 seconds using a 2/4 second cadence.

If you stop short of 90, the weight is too heavy, if you can perform the exercise past 90, it's too light, and weight needs to be added.
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Cheers. I take it that by failure you mean - unassisted failure. If so, what are your thoughts on the following:
- do you think it's worthwhile going beyond unassisted failure?
- if so, on each set to failure, or say once per muscle group per week?
 
Plenty of muscle has been built by people that didn't train to failure so that would make you think it's not necessary for muscle growth.

What's optimal? I'm not sure.
 
It just takes the guess work out of it, ensures you pushed your limit and maxed out.
Sometimes you have a good day and get that last rep up when you werent expecting to. I'd still call that failure, cos you know your body well enough now that to try another rep would be futile, so failure was reached.
Attmpting a lift that gets you 2" and needs your spotter to intervene is useles, failure was reached on the previous rep. If you failed at 3/4 of the rep, than you gave it your best.
 
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