Big Mick
"2014 - Kunce of the year"
Not sure about this, reps seem to work better.
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Not sure about this, reps seem to work better.
The Hamburgler
Spotter Loader
imo TUT is probably a better measuring point than just the rep count itself
Big Mick
"2014 - Kunce of the year"
Pump is very different to feeling target muscle working, I feel my target muscle working after the first warm up set, but even after multiple working sets there is still no pump where the muscle is flooded with blood, not to be confused with sore and worked, definitely feel the target muscle after it's worked.
If you are saying that feeling the target muscle being worked is the pump, my guess is you have never had a real pump.
I think I will start adding a 'finisher' set to the end of my set after the working sets to get that blood to the muscle being worked and see if it makes a difference.
Here is Arnold describing the 'pump' in his own sensitive and politically correct way:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKpKjzt1fIg
If you are saying that feeling the target muscle being worked is the pump, my guess is you have never had a real pump.
I think I will start adding a 'finisher' set to the end of my set after the working sets to get that blood to the muscle being worked and see if it makes a difference.
Here is Arnold describing the 'pump' in his own sensitive and politically correct way:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKpKjzt1fIg
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Neddysmith
Standard kunce
I tend to look at things in a similat way, "the pump" is where the muscle feels like it is going to explode out of the skin because there is so much blood flowing in and around the muscle area, usually i can only get this feeling through doing high rep stuff.
Feeling the muscle being worked is a different feeling and more something like fatigue and sore, this is where the mind muscle connection comes into play.
Big Mick
"2014 - Kunce of the year"
Yep this is it right there. I can feel the muscle worked every time I train, but the pump is something different all together.
The reason I started this thread was as I was wondering if the pump would increase muscle growth due to the extra nutrients brought into the area by the blood. I am guessing it might make a difference, surly can't do any harm.
Neddysmith
Standard kunce
I do subscribe to this theory, not based on any scientific evidence, so could be completely bro science, however.....
I like to start off with heavier weights and lower rep stuff and concerntrate on working the muscle to it's fullest then finishing off with the higher rep stuff once the muscle has been fatigued to get as much blood flowing into the muscle as possible for both recovery and growth.
I know some guys who are strong and train purely for strength, yet they are not what i would consider big, they do mainly low rep stuff and only worry about weight lifted, I ALSO know quite a few bodybuilders who could not care less if they are lifting the 5kg DBs as long as they are building muscle for when they hit the stage, even though they look and appear to be extremely strong this is not always the case.
Goosey
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Pumping the muscle is usually unavoidable when an exercise is productive, I think a new trainee will feel the pump because for the first time within the limit of their experience they notice the effects of blood flooding the muscle worked.
To a seasoned trainee and as a byproduct of exercise, he becomes unaware of the pumped effect.
I think an extreme degree of pumping does nothing in the way of biulding either size or strength.
A high or extreme degree of the pumped feel can be achieved by a lighter weight and higher rep's, especially partial range movements.
But I reckon as long as your training remains unchanged, your pump as opposed to to cold measurements of a muscle could indicate future growth in advance.
To a seasoned trainee and as a byproduct of exercise, he becomes unaware of the pumped effect.
I think an extreme degree of pumping does nothing in the way of biulding either size or strength.
A high or extreme degree of the pumped feel can be achieved by a lighter weight and higher rep's, especially partial range movements.
But I reckon as long as your training remains unchanged, your pump as opposed to to cold measurements of a muscle could indicate future growth in advance.
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M@YHEM
Member
The simple answer to your question is NO it won't increase muscle growth. The only effect the PUMP has on anything is that is tells you that you've trained that muscle. Nothing more nothing less. They market PUMP in pre-workout supps for marketing hype only.
Goosey
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I think what mick is eluding to is an extreme degree of pump.
In the 70's to the 90's, (I don't know about now as I don't follow bodybiulding anymore,) on of the many superstitions or myths was that many in the ranks of bodybiulders believed they could maintain a state of semi-pump as a result of their workouts, this is as you say as a result of advertising.
When any degree of pumping is evident, it is simply an indication the the circulatory system is momentarily unable to meet the requirements of working muscles.
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M@YHEM
Member
I guess on that theory then it would be the length of time you could hold the pump. I know when I take agmatine I hold my pump for hours after. I would say there would be to many variants to get a true indicator of growth from the pump though.
Big Mick
"2014 - Kunce of the year"
Some interesting feed back.
Not sure it's advertising that is promoting the pump. Big Arnie was a big believer in before pre workout supplements existed.
I don't take any pre workout supplements, used to use the old BN Pre Workout NT when it was around, but stopped using it after it was no longer sold and have not bothered with any other pre workout, and really have noted no difference.
Not sure it's advertising that is promoting the pump. Big Arnie was a big believer in before pre workout supplements existed.
I don't take any pre workout supplements, used to use the old BN Pre Workout NT when it was around, but stopped using it after it was no longer sold and have not bothered with any other pre workout, and really have noted no difference.
Big Mick
"2014 - Kunce of the year"
I seem to subscribe to this theory as well to some degree, not sure why and I have no evidence to back it
But I also know a lot of guys a LOT stronger than me yet they are smaller than me so I don't think strength is 100% necessary for size, but it helps I guess. My lifts are quite poor strength wise considering I am over 115kg and not very fat.
Also looking at getting my lifts up again and above my current PB's over the next 6 months, as I am not getting any younger, and I am going for gold at the moment, aiming for huge changes in appearance over the next 12 months, hence me starting all these threads on protein and training. looking at maximising my gains across the board.
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Goosey
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I seem to subscribe to this theory as well to some degree, not sure why and I have no evidence to back it
But I also know a lot of guys a LOT stronger than me yet they are smaller than me so I don't think strength is 100% necessary for size, but it helps I guess. My lifts are quite poor strength wise considering I am over 115kg and not very fat.
Also looking at getting my lifts up again and above my current PB's over the next 6 months, as I am not getting any younger, and I am going for gold at the moment, aiming for huge changes in appearance over the next 12 months, hence me starting all these threads on protein and training. looking at maximising my gains across the board.
Going down another path but that maybe due to leverages (big engine, poor transmission)
M@YHEM
Member
True, but wasn't he talking about it being a good feeling more than anything.
Yeah I'm thinking the same thing. Some days I'm stronger on pre-workout supps and some days I have a shit session on pre-workouts.
jzpowahz
Well-known member
Totally agree.
I do chinups with a very slow negative portion. Just a couple of reps of these and I'm done.
Also, look up myo reps. I do these when I'm short on time. Absolutely, most pump I ever get actually.
Timeah
Captain Kunce
Same here chris. Can acheive a pump in almost any rep range. Just depends on tempo. Bb curls for eg. If I keep them heavy, ie 5 or 6 reps max I still get an epic pump after 3 or 4 sets. The same pump id get with a weight that I get mabe 10 or 11 reps. Either way it burns like fark.
Tim.
Tim.
Goosey
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I don't agree with using TUT as a measure, but, as usual the topic segways.
I think op is or was, ( I don't really know) was actually enquiring whether extreme pumping is productive.
BigMick is this what you are questioning?