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Off-topic-but-still-related-to-PL-thread

I'm starting to doubt whether or not steroids increase absolute results these days.
I think the main benefit is just allowing you to be as muscular as possible in a higher weight class that you wouldn't be able to get to naturally and they of course increase the rate at which you make results
 
I am told- for the Ruskies etc at least- that its all about recovery. You take drugs and it enables you to train more frequently. Pack in 50% more volume and you'll be stronger. But I'm no expert.
 
Im told the ruskies down cold beers on their rest days and call it Australian Volume Program
 
If the athlete has only limited training experience and has loaded himself up with Anabolic-Androgenic Steroids, (AAS) then his gains will almost reverse after his short lifting career. The psych wards can pick up the shattered pieces afterwards....

The misuse/abuse of Growth hormones seems to be greater these days and perhaps that is assisting with the permanent gains to lean bodyweight.

The greater the lean bodyweight, the greater the potential performance. That's all very good if you don't mind increased risk of renal problems, acromegaly and heart failure. The internal organs including the heart grow, but unfortunately the heart valves stay the same size.

The most beneficial effect of AAS misuse is their effect on the liver, and this is particularly true for certain orally administered drugs. They render the liver incapable of breaking down the hormone cortisol. High levels of cortisol deaden the receptors the would normally shut your muscles down under extreme load. But the effect is totally reversible, unless of course you happen to develop cancer of the liver along the way or kill yourself.
 
Equipoise is a common drug for weightlifters. Very anabolic not very androgenic. Same for dianabol, very common for eastern Europeans to be on 20-30mg all year round. You'll notice that drugs like trenbolone are not popular at all apart from in American equipped lifting circles. Very androgenic and will not help with recovery and even hinder it despite these drugs making you brutally strong very fast. Lots of strongmen reportedly take up to 500mg of anadrol a day leading up to a comp for this reason. Yes you read that right
 
0ni said:
Equipoise is a common drug for weightlifters. Very anabolic not very androgenic. Same for dianabol, very common for eastern Europeans to be on 20-30mg all year round. You'll notice that drugs like trenbolone are not popular at all apart from in American equipped lifting circles. Very androgenic and will not help with recovery and even hinder it despite these drugs making you brutally strong very fast. Lots of strongmen reportedly take up to 500mg of anadrol a day leading up to a comp for this reason. Yes you read that right
Click to expand...

Anadrol was available in Australia as Anapolon (oxymetholone) tablets. It was frightfully expensive and highly sought after by bodybuilders and strength athletes alike. Whereas the powerlifter would take one or two anapolon tabs a day stacked with his oil of choice, the bodybuilders would take four to six, plus oils, plus halotestin, plus somatotropin.

Anapolon was widely abused and was withdrawn from most pharmacies in late 90's. It was intended for use by terminally ill people with certain types of blood cancer. Needless to say it was very toxic to the liver and the users so etimes took on an interesting color and a big puffy moon face.
 
At any rate- even the top Russians who have medical resources at their disposal to help them beat the tests get sprung in OCTs. Like I said I don't have an intimate knowledge of drugs and how people beat the tests but I am inclined to think its no so easy to beat the test, the issue is more about how good the testing regime is. The places where cheating is evident seem to be places where there haven't been good independent OCTs. In oz we do have a good testing regime. So I'm inclined to say PA is drug tested AND the top guys are drug free. Nothing is perfect, but I don't go for the argument that since cheating is possible the idea of drug-free is useless or not worthwhile. Ok I love this little soap box.
 
Yeah it's used in children with anaemia
5mg/kg is the starting dose for that if anyone is interested. Lots of people hate on these drugs because they kill your liver or some such when it is not unusual for a 100kg male to be on 500mg a day for non life threatening anaemia for up to a year before liver problems start to come to light
 
Spritcha said:
At any rate- even the top Russians who have medical resources at their disposal to help them beat the tests get sprung in OCTs. Like I said I don't have an intimate knowledge of drugs and how people beat the tests but I am inclined to think its no so easy to beat the test, the issue is more about how good the testing regime is. The places where cheating is evident seem to be places where there haven't been good independent OCTs. In oz we do have a good testing regime. So I'm inclined to say PA is drug tested AND the top guys are drug free. Nothing is perfect, but I don't go for the argument that since cheating is possible the idea of drug-free is useless or not worthwhile. Ok I love this little soap box.
Click to expand...

Steroid free most likely looking at the evidence. Drug free is harder... how do you test for peptide hormone use? Stimulant use in training as well. When I competed in cycling drug use was VERY popular. People (including myself) would be taking 10-20mg of dianabol while they compete and it was tested. Blood doping was very popular as well but that doesn't really help much with powerlifting. Peptide use was very high as well as using drugs like albuterol. I did get a vibe of accepted drug use in cycling though which is different to the IPF
 
Question for you Stephen or Steven also:

My bench sucks balls, I lack the ability to grind but I also lack top end strength. I rep for 7 touch and go 87.5% of what I pause for 1. When I lift a max I have a real fucked up lift that starts fast, hits the sticking point and is a real grinder all the way to the finish. When I miss a lift it stays at the sticking point for maybe 4-5 seconds.

So I need to concentrate on my top end strength but I lack the ability to grind and need to smooth out my lift so it's a more constant speed, what is best for this? I was thinking paused sets of 3 up to a max and a few paused sets of 5 as down sets, does this sound like a logical choice? Breaking touch and go rep PBs got me very good at repping and a little increase in top end strength but not so much
 
What assistance work are you doing Oni? Are you demolishing those triceps with some volume assistance?
 
0ni said:
Question for you Stephen or Steven also:

My bench sucks balls, I lack the ability to grind but I also lack top end strength. I rep for 7 touch and go 87.5% of what I pause for 1. When I lift a max I have a real fucked up lift that starts fast, hits the sticking point and is a real grinder all the way to the finish. When I miss a lift it stays at the sticking point for maybe 4-5 seconds.
Click to expand...

These are the hallmarks of a former endurance athlete. your strength curve will be difficult to reform if your formative years were as an endurance athlete.

If your strength endurance is good, maybe you should look to maximise that natural ability. The limit strength will follow and you will probably make greater gains to your limit strength this way rather than trying to re-form your strength curve.

Take a look at the old Tom Platz vs Hatfield squat contest. Hatfield only just pipped old thunder thighs on the limit strength, but who do you think was the more impressive lifter on that day?
 
You might want to try adding in assistace work around your lifts. Smash those triceps for example. Also try adding in some partial movements like floor presses, boards, rack presses. Some heavy DB work never goes astray as well.

Main lift + assistance

Thats what the doctor prescribes.

If I were you Id write a decent 6 week programming cycle with assistance and stick to it... then try your max effort, see if its worked. The only way to know if something has worked is to put a strict plan of attack in place... like science ;)
 
vonfram88 said:
These are the hallmarks of a former endurance athlete. your strength curve will be difficult to reform if your formative years were as an endurance athlete.

If your strength endurance is good, maybe you should look to maximise that natural ability. The limit strength will follow and you will probably make greater gains to your limit strength this way rather than trying to re-form your strength curve.

Take a look at the old Tom Platz vs Hatfield squat contest. Hatfield only just pipped old thunder thighs on the limit strength, but who do you think was the more impressive lifter in the day?
Click to expand...

Von he should still be able to make some decent strength gains. Its not like hes plateued at 140kg bench @ 70kg.
 
0ni said:
I just do rep work for bench
Click to expand...

Thats your problem, you need skull crushers, rope pull downs, chins and dips. Your triceps and upper back are weak.

<in b4 you reference numerous studies proving me wrong>
 
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