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High intensity training over str, for muscle gains.

So bazza ur gonna say to a beginner that wants to one day win a bodybuilding compeition, you will tell them to train like a powerlifter there whole career? Seriouslly mate get your head out of ur ass. There isnt any professional bodybuilders that train like powerlifters, sure there are some that incorporate some powerlifting in there routine, but its about 20% the other 80% is more of high intensity approach. Look at all the past mr olympias and looked how they trained. Sure powerlifting will get you a descent pysique and size, but it aint gonna win you 1st place in a bodybuilding competition, which is what im trying to say, but you keep saying the same shit over and over> which is you need to get stronger to build muscle......... im not talking about that, im talking about what is the best training to get that bodybuilders pysique.

p.si do think Str/powerlifting training is good for someone like a skinny beginner starting off, like they say *you cant sculpt a pebble* but once some mass is made, there isnt any need to continue this str/powerlifting approach if you want to be a *bodybuilder*
 
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pumpiniron said:
So bazza to beginner that wants to one day win a bodybuilding compeition, you will tell them to train like a powerlifter? Seriouslly mate get your head out of ur ass. There isnt any professional bodybuilders that train like powerlifters, sure there are some that incorporate some powerlifting in there routine, but its about 20% the other 80% is more of high intensity approach. Look at all the past mr olympias and looked how they trained. Sure powerlifting will get you a descent pysique and size, but it aint gonna win you 1st place in a bodybuilding competition, which is what im trying to say, but you keep saying the same shit over and over> which is you need to get stronger to build muscle......... im not talking about that, im talking about what is the best training to get that bodybuilders pysique.
Click to expand...

The best training program imo... Would use a combination of both... Dependant on the person and what they respond best to...

For a begginer wanting to one day enter a body building comp with no lifting experience at all.... They would need to spend two to three years doing strength based training on the big lifts.... And get very strong...

Then you would inject steriods and train BB style....:cool:

All just IMO of course...

Remembering that Power lifters gain benefits from using BB approaches... And BB'ers can equally make gains from the PL approach...

Somewhere in the middle is the answer...
 
nazzysmith said:
The best training program imo... Would use a combination of both... Dependant on the person and what they respond best to...

For a begginer wanting to one day enter a body building comp with no lifting experience at all.... They would need to spend two to three years doing strength based training on the big lifts.... And get very strong...

Then you would inject steriods and train BB style....:cool:

All just IMO of course...

Remembering that Power lifters gain benefits from using BB approaches... And BB'ers can equally make gains from the PL approach...

Somewhere in the middle is the answer...
Click to expand...

Yer ur right mate, couldnt agree more. Beginners need to build the foundation first.
 
Also the main difference affecting the outcome between a PLer and a BBer is diet!!!

And Zyzz's physique was not just from his weight lifting approach ... Was all the other assistance...
 
Crikey
This has to be the most childish shit I've read in a long time.

Firstly pumpiniron, what is *your* ideal as a bodybiulding physique that *you* see.
Please elucidate.

Secondly, The best training to biuld muscle and strength is what bazza20 is trying to tell you and if he doesn't mind I will try explain it; lift heavy, very heavy and make it progressive, the amount and frequecy of work you do is up to you and how quickly you can recover between workouts,I'm pretty sure that is all he is saying, I hope.

forget about the bodybiulder versus powerbuilder stuff, throw that out the window.



Train hard
Train smart
Train safe
 
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The other thing is that I've never seen anyone biuld strength on a low intensity program but at the end of the day, the intensity of work is subjective but the results are tangible.
 
pumpiniron said:
So bazza ur gonna say to a beginner that wants to one day win a bodybuilding compeition, you will tell them to train like a powerlifter there whole career? Seriouslly mate get your head out of ur ass. There isnt any professional bodybuilders that train like powerlifters, sure there are some that incorporate some powerlifting in there routine, but its about 20% the other 80% is more of high intensity approach. Look at all the past mr olympias and looked how they trained. Sure powerlifting will get you a descent pysique and size, but it aint gonna win you 1st place in a bodybuilding competition, which is what im trying to say, but you keep saying the same shit over and over> which is you need to get stronger to build muscle......... im not talking about that, im talking about what is the best training to get that bodybuilders pysique.

p.si do think Str/powerlifting training is good for someone like a skinny beginner starting off, like they say *you cant sculpt a pebble* but once some mass is made, there isnt any need to continue this str/powerlifting approach if you want to be a *bodybuilder*
Click to expand...

Seriously what is going on here, i cant believe that these posts just keep getting stupider. You keep regurgitating up shit I haven't even remotely been saying. Where did I say a BB should train like a powerlifter their whole career. You are just making up stupid statements that I have not even been saying. I really suggest you learn to read.

The whole way along I have been saying no matter what way you train if you want to get bigger you need to get stronger in some way. Like I have said all along this doesnt have to mean stronger in 1rm, somehow this is what you seem to keep getting confused on. Just because someone gets stronger it doesn't have to mean they are training like powerlifters. It can also be more, reps more sets, longer time under tension. If you are doing the exact same shit as now in 2 years you will not be bigger. Seriously I don't know why I even bother because you are just going to miss this yet again and say something stupid like I am saying all BBs should train like powerlifters all the time.

Also like I have said you cant say strength training didn't work for you because you didn't actually get strong. If you dont even get strong on a strength program how is it supposed to build muscle. It's like using slow reps to build muscle but then doing normal rep speed and then blaming slow reps for not building muscle if it doesn't work.

Also it's STRENGTH not str.
 
U do see however guys that weigh 90 kilos and are muscley and ripped to the shithouse and cant even bench 120 kilos, and you see people 90kg that train for str and dont even look like they lift and can bench 140 kilos.
 
You talk the most shit ever. People have commented on onis shit talking skills but at least he backs it with a bit of logic and internet research.

You're off the fucking chart!
 
Bazza20 said:
Heard all this shit before and he makes the same mistakes as others do. He tries to disregard strength by comparing strength levels and size of different lifters. Doesn't work that way, but if an individual increases there strength in someway chances are they will get bigger. He also makes the mistake of using 1RM as the only form of strength.

Fact is no one gets bigger by progressively getting weaker over time. You need to get stronger over time, that doesn't necessarily mean 1rm strength, there are plenty of other areas of strength to develop.

People read this shit to justify curling 5kg dumbbells and squatting 20kg saying strength doesnt matter. Have a look at all the pro BBs none of them would be weaker than when they first started lifting. They will have all progressed a shit load since they started.
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Pumpiniron
There is nothing wrong with what is said here and it is only an opinion based on self evident truth, just settle.

As I've written also, and 99% of members here agree.... lift heavy, lift hard, there is no controversy.
 
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But I reckon it has also been a spirited discussion, which is good.

And to be honest I only read the first paragraph And skimmed through the rest and thought yep, this is just the same stuff over and over.
 
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Ok bazza, lets get some things perfectly clear.

The main message from the article said *wait for it* High volume of work with muliple sets of higher reps aka 5-10, 10-15. with shorter rests recruit more motor unit and muscle fibre breakdown........ and you come in saying, how the fuck do you build muscle if ur getting weaker............... where the fuck in the article did it say ur going to get weaker........ scott says train for devlopment and str will come, not the other way around and i agreed with you 100 times that yes you need to get stronger to build muscle........................ but like i keep saying the article isnt even talking about that, its talking about what is the best way to train for that bodybuilders pysique, and you keep brining up this str shit, when the article isnt even talking about that.
 
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