Repitition requirements

For the purpose of building a body and strengthening it what to you is the most important part of the repitition?

I am not sure Goosey, how about a hint.

The part where you pick it up and then put it down again.

Crikey that was quick bloke, you posted before I got the poll up.

I posted this because after all these years of picking shit up and down I conclude it is the negative part that seem to facilitate complete results, I'll explain later.

Not saying its right or wrong, just an observation and I'm interested in the thoughts of people here, because there really is a wide cross section of lifters posting here.

Goosey said:

For the purpose of building a body and strengthening it what to you is the most important part of the repitition?

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OK, I'll bite Gooseman. Whilst I don't train for Bodybuilding or Powerlifting, I'll say the negative is moreso important for Bodybuilding, but the up is moreso for sport specific.

My head really hurts........

But i do think that most of these factors come into play, i just depends when you choose to utilise the training methods, things such as time under tension, weight, explsovise movements, number of reps etc etc, all these are good to throw into your workouts every now and then for aworkout or two.

thePoo2012 said:

OK, I'll bite Gooseman. Whilst I don't train for Bodybuilding or Powerlifting, I'll say the negative is moreso important for Bodybuilding, but the up is moreso for sport specific.

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Yeah I don't either, I train because of the by-products it produces.

But as "exercise" is meant to be safe and an exercise to improve condition and reduce injury by improving movment I'm interested in this topic.

Regardless of the activity, exercise must be a component of it.

the important thing is maximal recruitment and creating fatigue.

this can be accomplished by many methods. hence why many things work.

Muscular activation across a range of motion with a balance of time under tension and load. For bodybuilding purposes, I suspect that neither eccentric nor concentric is more important than the other (and if it is, not by a huge amount), but you'd be a fool not to make the most of both. If they are about equal, and you do one really well and the other at the lowest quality possible, then you're probably only doing each full rep to about half the value it could have been done at.

ETA: When I refer to time under tension, I'm not limiting that term to consecutive TUT, nor am I sticking to a set period of time being ideal. Rather, I'd say the higher the %1RM loaded for full, quality reps, over the most amount of time (within a set, within a session, or even within a training career), the more muscle is likely to be built.

An old power-lifting trick is to perform heavy negatives to shock the muscles and increase strength. It works very well.

Just like beginners are advised to perform the negative part of a chin up, in order to gain enough strength to perform the complete movement. The negative is also a good thing to do when you can no longer perform the full movement. Doing them to near failure after regular chins works wonders. As it does for most other exercises.

And then you have heavy partials to overcome sticking points - but that's another topic, I think.

GUZZLA said:

An old power-lifting trick is to perform heavy negatives to shock the muscles and increase strength. It works very well.

Just like beginners are advised to perform the negative part of a chin up, in order to gain enough strength to perform the complete movement. The negative is also a good thing to do when you can no longer perform the full movement. Doing them to near failure after regular chins works wonders. As it does for most other exercises.

And then you have heavy partials to overcome sticking points - but that's another topic, I think.

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thats based on the concept that you can lower more weight than you can lift?

thePoo2012 said:

thats based on the concept that you can lower more weight than you can lift?

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That's how I've always understood it.

all the above( top 5) in good form

thePoo2012 said:

thats based on the concept that you can lower more weight than you can lift?

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Yes, that's true, but it has more to do with overload principles. If you consider a sprinter who trains with a parachute, his body is being conditioned to extra resistance. When the chute is removed, they will typically run faster or with more efficiency now the load is removed. Just like doing chins with a weighted vest for a few weeks. Once the vest is removed, you should be able to do more chin ups.

From a weight training perspective, someones 1RM might have become stagnant or not increased proportionally in one lift compared to other body parts. For those that rarely train with lower reps, when you get to 1-3RM's, typically the muscle and the mind are not conditioned to such sudden and extreme weights. If you aren't use to that kind of load, you won't be moving it far.

Enter, Negatives. They are usually performed with weights about 10% over your 1RM. Let's use bench press as an example; Ideally, you need 3 spotters - one on each end of the bar and one in the middle. Load the bar up 10% over your predetermined 1RM and have all three assistants help un-rack the bar. The bloke in the middle never lets go of the bar as he helps giude it down. The other two get ready to catch if it goes pear-shaped. From lockout, you begin lowering the bar. After about 1/2 way, it will feel like your just trying to slow it down. At the bottom, the spotters lift the weight back to the top and you go again.

Essentially, what you are doing is training the muscle and your mind to handle weights heavier than what you're typically use to. When done regularly, the next time you try your 1RM, you will be comfortable with the weight and you should find it that little bit easier. Hell, you might have just managed to boost your 1RM a couple of KG's.

Just remember, form is absolutely critical here. You are working with some serious weights on compound lifts. When done correctly, good gains can be made, without injuries.

Best not to train negatives like that...

Just my opinion....

Too much weight on the bar does more bad then good imo....

That sounds like a bad idea to me. Lets leave it to some of the more experienced powerlifters to comment on that sticky, NAPARM or freako might enlighten us on the merits or detriments of training negatives like that.

If you believe in the idea that weight increases and improves flexibility by forcing body part into extended position, then that can only be achieved when the negative is used, without using the negative your flexibility would not improve could even get worse.

Incorporating the pre stretch actually produces power to achieve the positive portion, when you draw your hand back to punch, draw you leg back to kick is not to increase ROM but stimulate the system to draw power.

You can in fact Can train just using negatives, which is far more productive than training using positive alone, even counterproductive at best.

I think the negative is the most underrated consideration, as you see many lift with intention only to basically drop the weight and lose tension on the muscle.

^^ I followed the guy who holds the record for a weighted chin up, he tore his bicep doing eccentrics with massive amounts of weight.... just saying. I steer clear of them.

I lift explosively, most of the time, trying to power through sticking points.

Never think about failing, the eccentric, or going slow if making a lift matters to you. Grit your teeth and go all out.

Exception is exercises where I'm vulnerable - dropping through the eccentric on chins is a great way to tear your bicep, and doing it on military presses I find is a good way to hurt your shoulder. Here I go for a controlled eccentric. Oh, and semi-warm up sets.