Run for your life! At a comfortable pace, and not too far

Thanks for posting @Fadi ; very interesting.


Perhaps [MENTION=3034]Rugby88[/MENTION]; and [MENTION=16241]Headley[/MENTION]; should watch this, after their, (I'll call it posting, some would call it shitposting), in my thread http://ausbb.com/showthread.php?t=26843&page=6&p=578880#post578880

A few points...

- It's a very good video, i like it
- Had a mate who was a 'Veteran endurance athlete' who died in his 30's from a heart attack, i now think it would be caused by what this guy is talking about
- I need to do some running again. Even though i hate running, i use to run about 2.5 kays 2-3 times a week at a jogging/running/walking pace.
- I can't imagine other sports having differing results. How many times to footy players train/exercise? How about swimmers?

As i said, its a very good video
[MENTION=12409]El Stiffy[/MENTION]; this video portrays better research than headline like lines of "Over 45's have worse hearts".

It's got me thinking of the Big Red Run now Live News

There are numerous sports people who have suffered bad hearts, possibly due to their type of training.

Lisa Curry Kenny and Evander Holyfield are two who spring to mind straight away. Both would have trained in a very HIIT fashion.

The vid eludes to the micro damage done to the heart due to exercise being taken to extremes. If done occasionally the heart recovers. If sustained for long periods, permanent damage can/does occur.

Someone mentioned Greg Welsh too.

Yep. It is a bit worrying. Especially the mortality stats for 'no running at all'

maybe I sometimes push it a bit too hard with pulse between 180 and 190 when running or cycling.

Maybe I need to watch it as I get older.

The max heart rate thing is a bit confusing though. I believe the official line is that you shouldn't go over 90% of (220 - age). Well, if I went by that then I would have to stop at the 5th rep of every exercise that I do, and not skip rope at all! But then that's no way to train isn't it.

yes, 220 minus age is wrong for many reasonably fit people.

for me (52y), my max is supposed to be 172.

90% of that is 155, which is quite comfortable for me.

Re the heart rate issue, you can take it too far, with negative consequences (and warning signs)! I vividly remember been pushed to such an extreme back in 1983 during a weightlifting circuit, that I simply collapsed/fainted...coughed up blood upon getting up! Granted, I never pushed so hard again (until few years ago) when I di my 100 burpees. For the 1st time in my life my heart beat was audible to my naked ears...now that was scary... Never again!

I've said it before and I'll repeat it now: it takes guts and determination to push through a tough barrier in one's training, but just the same and the flip side of that same coin is that, it takes just as much dedication to hold back from an all out effort, especially when all seems to be going just fine. That's why my training motto is: 1 1/2 steps forward 1 step back.



Fadi.

Its hard to put Elite athletes in the mix as years of training, dieting, comp prep etc etc etc will take its toll on the body someway or another - of course yes it could be directly linked to HIT training (which pretty much all Athletes will do at some point/variations of) - but I think it would be more a mix of alot of different factors when you are talking about an athletes health - at the end or coming to the end of their career. What they are doing is not a "natural" thing for the body to do as such they are pushing it to an extreme someway or another everyweek, everyday.....

Of course HIT training could have a negative effect of the average joe that trains - maybe - but so could other factors due to training and exercise - do I think the normal average trainer does enough to do damage? Prob for the 95% of people prop not - but as mention above some people who do fall in that athlete range be it due to being an athlete or simply training like one for a number of years - of course training as whole could come with some negatives....

Rugby88 said:

Its hard to put Elite athletes in the mix as years of training, dieting, comp prep etc etc etc will take its toll on the body someway or another - of course yes it could be directly linked to HIT training (which pretty much all Athletes will do at some point/variations of) - but I think it would be more a mix of alot of different factors when you are talking about an athletes health - at the end or coming to the end of their career. What they are doing is not a "natural" thing for the body to do as such they are pushing it to an extreme someway or another everyweek, everyday.....

Of course HIT training could have a negative effect of the average joe that trains - maybe - but so could other factors due to training and exercise - do I think the normal average trainer does enough to do damage? Prob for the 95% of people prop not - but as mention above some people who do fall in that athlete range be it due to being an athlete or simply training like one for a number of years - of course training as whole could come with some negatives....

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A Very Balanced Point Of View With That Contribution Of Yours Sir. Thank you.

I don't think my heart rate has ever been higher than about 145... People talking about 220 - age meaning you have about 170 or so is surprising.

Being 34, if my heart rate was (220 - 34) - 10% i think i would be dying lol

My life fits right in the middle, between the marathoners and couch potatoes.

Rugby88 said:

Its hard to put Elite athletes in the mix as years of training, dieting, comp prep etc etc etc will take its toll on the body someway or another - of course yes it could be directly linked to HIT training (which pretty much all Athletes will do at some point/variations of) - but I think it would be more a mix of alot of different factors when you are talking about an athletes health - at the end or coming to the end of their career. What they are doing is not a "natural" thing for the body to do as such they are pushing it to an extreme someway or another everyweek, everyday.....

Of course HIT training could have a negative effect of the average joe that trains - maybe - but so could other factors due to training and exercise - do I think the normal average trainer does enough to do damage? Prob for the 95% of people prop not - but as mention above some people who do fall in that athlete range be it due to being an athlete or simply training like one for a number of years - of course training as whole could come with some negatives....

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Hey Joel, can you please elucidate by what you mean in regards to "HIT- Training" ?

HIT, in the true sense of the word, by Ellington Darden (who actually coined this term) is;

A full body workout, using one set of an exercise use a controlled rep cadence, upper body 8-12, lower body 10-15, to MMF with minimal rest between sets, in that you go to failure, get your breath back, move to the next exercise, the duration of the workout should last no more than 30 minutes and you should feel as though you have done physical activity, but able to do it again, but you don't of course.

these style workouts should be done no more than three times a week.

i think for the general population, 95% this method of exercise is the safest in regard to safety and longevity.

Headley, i think Armstrong had a pulse range of resting 30 to max 200.

Mine is about 48 to 190, although I think I could get near 200 if I was tested.

Silverback said:

Hey Joel, can you please elucidate by what you mean in regards to "HIT- Training" ?

HIT, in the true sense of the word, by Ellington Darden (who actually coined this term) is;

A full body workout, using one set of an exercise use a controlled rep cadence, upper body 8-12, lower body 10-15, to MMF with minimal rest between sets, in that you go to failure, get your breath back, move to the next exercise, the duration of the workout should last no more than 30 minutes and you should feel as though you have done physical activity, but able to do it again, but you don't of course.

these style workouts should be done no more than three times a week.

i think for the general population, 95% this method of exercise is the safest in regard to safety and longevity.

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Hey mate -

The wiki page explains it well - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_intensity_training

I am not saying HIT is bad at all - I love HIT and I think everyone should be doing some form of HIT in their training be it if they are a average joe training or a elite powerlifter - I was trying to point out in a round about way that HIT training I dont feel for the large % of the training world will have any negative effect on them - of course as my post above states - taking in training life, training level, other factors - of course there could be negative effects on the athlete/person training in the long term - this is a maybe and I honestly as stated above think training could have a negative effect on someone who is training at a high level for a long time - do I think this is directed solely due to doing HIT - no I dont to be honest - I was simply trying to be diplomatic in my post above lol....

I agree 95%-100%! of everyone who trains should include some aspects of HIT into their training program...

I guess its relating back to articles like this - http://ausbb.com/showthread.php?t=26843 - which I feel is a media stir up on a slow news day...

Thanks for the reply.

From talking to many close to Arthur jones, he was about *efficiency* of exercise and hard work, his time was spent looking at; what was the minimal amount needed to obtain maximum results, I believe he achieved this mostly.

But to workout this way is tough and leads to the topic of metabolic conditioning, and something that the cross fitters are adopting.

He never used the term; H.I.T, this term was used by Darden in his many books,

Metabolic conditioning fascinates me, and I think it's key to good health and a long life.
I've always followed what Arthur used to say...you rest long enough between sets to recover enough to give a maximum effort on the next set...
of course, your mental set is "push"...
and as you get in better condition
the duration of that rest interval
decreases.


I've never been a fan of
whipping through a work-out with no rest(and getting sick)...when you first start training hard you certainly might exceed your your
metabolic abilities to recover and you might feel woozie...with time you will extend those metabolic recovery abilities and your system will adjust to the hard training.


You always
push hard...but getting sick isn't a
necessary part of training hard.
And speed-balling through a work-out
isn't necessary either.

spartacus said:

Headley, i think Armstrong had a pulse range of resting 30 to max 200.

Mine is about 48 to 190, although I think I could get near 200 if I was tested.

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No doubt. In my uneducated opinion, a very low resting rate of 30-50 or so is a good sign of a good heart?

Not sure if I am healthy. My pulse quickly goes to 150-160 just jogging at 10km per hour.

I have thalassemia minor, which adversely affects my endurance. I don't utilise oxygen as efficiently as a normal person.

Headley said:

No doubt. In my uneducated opinion, a very low resting rate of 30-50 or so is a good sign of a good heart?

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The stated 'normal' range is 60-80 so I expect there can be good and bad reasons for someone to have a HR below 60. When I'm unfit (most of the time) my resting HR is 50-52 so when i do a medical I let the nurse know that's normal for me.