Any tips for avoiding amenorrhea? Also any female bb's here?

This is more of a question for the women here &/or those that have trained women to "competition ready" states.
When I was last training I developed orthorexia/anorexia and ended up with (secondary) amenorrhea- that is, I lost so much body fat that I ceased menstruating for about 8 months. The problem with secondary amenorrhea is that women lose bone density and are much more likely to develop osteoporosis and suffer fractures etc etc.
Obviously I don't want to end up with osteo, nor do I particularly want to break any more ribs down the line, however I do want to get back to similar levels of body fat if I can do so and was wondering if there are any tricks to keeping the body happy with less than normal body fat?

Also, are there any women training towards fitness/physique comps here?
Emma

Women are naturally meant to have a higher level of bodyfat than men, it's simply necessary. You need to maintain a level of normal just above the point where things stop happening until your about to compete.

Male bodybuilders may drop to 3 or 4% bodyfat for a day, but it's impossible and unhealthy to keep up forever.

I will admit I don't know anything about female bb though

I just really dislike carrying much body fat and to get the level of striation and vascularity that I like to have on a daily basis I find that my body stops functioning as well as it should.
Not that it's an issue at the moment, I'm carrying more than enough body fat right now but going on my past efforts I should be back in shape within 6 months and I want to try and reduce repeat problems if I can.
(the downside of being lean for us women is the loss of boobs, but I'd rather have a good physique and no boobs than a flabby tummy and tits lol)

skram said:

I just really dislike carrying much body fat and to get the level of striation and vascularity that I like to have on a daily basis I find that my body stops functioning as well as it should.
Not that it's an issue at the moment, I'm carrying more than enough body fat right now but going on my past efforts I should be back in shape within 6 months and I want to try and reduce repeat problems if I can.
(the downside of being lean for us women is the loss of boobs, but I'd rather have a good physique and no boobs than a flabby tummy and tits lol)

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Men like meat...

As long as you keep a fat ass amd some boob we are happy.

No one minds a little bit of pudge on the stomach.

Not alot of guys find 6packs attractive.

This isn't meant to sound harsh, but honestly? I don't really care what someone else wants for my body. I train for me, to feel strong and fit and capable, not for someone else's approval (and certainly not to pick up- I'm a single mum, I don't have the time haha).
If they know me then they'll like me for me, if someone choses to judge me because I don't fit into their narrow definition of what a "real" woman looks like, screw 'em

I hope you don't think I'm having a go, I'm not. But life's too short to try and appease everyone's ideal of what a woman should be, y'know?
Em

skram said:

This isn't meant to sound harsh, but honestly? I don't really care what someone else wants for my body. I train for me, to feel strong and fit and capable, not for someone else's approval (and certainly not to pick up- I'm a single mum, I don't have the time haha).
If they know me then they'll like me for me, if someone choses to judge me because I don't fit into their narrow definition of what a "real" woman looks like, screw 'em

I hope you don't think I'm having a go, I'm not. But life's too short to try and appease everyone's ideal of what a woman should be, y'know?
Em

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Life too short to develop amenorrhea for no good reason as well.

Someone with Anorexia nervosa usually does that for themself as well as others would tell them not to do it so it must be for self.

My point was for a positive not a narrow view of what men want. A fairly large view of what men want. The narrow view of what women should be would be 4%bodyfat freakoids.

skram said:

This isn't meant to sound harsh, but honestly? I don't really care what someone else wants for my body. I train for me, to feel strong and fit and capable, not for someone else's approval (and certainly not to pick up- I'm a single mum, I don't have the time haha).
If they know me then they'll like me for me, if someone choses to judge me because I don't fit into their narrow definition of what a "real" woman looks like, screw 'em

I hope you don't think I'm having a go, I'm not. But life's too short to try and appease everyone's ideal of what a woman should be, y'know?
Em

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Well said, stuff what anyone thinks its about what you want to do. I had an ex gf 7 years ago that competed in a few NABBA shows as a bodybuilder, she used to do her diets up herself, getting in the single digits of BF always messed with her menstruating as well. After the comps though she would go back up to 12-14% which is still quite lean especialy for a female. Just have to find a happy medium

Happy medium? What's that? lol
You're right though, it's just so easy to fall into that mindset where you keep pushing yourself if you KWIM. Like a lot of people who train hard I can be pretty tough on myself, much more than I would be with anyone else, but I guess trying to find a happy medium is part of learning how to train, & live, effectively (rather than compulsively haha).

Life too short to develop amenorrhea for no good reason as well.

Someone with Anorexia nervosa usually does that for themself as well as others would tell them not to do it so it must be for self.

My point was for a positive not a narrow view of what men want. A fairly large view of what men want. The narrow view of what women should be would be 4%bodyfat freakoids.

I agree. I'm just trying to find a middle ground between the urge to push oneself to the extreme and not pushing hard enough.
Thanks for clarifying- like I said, I wasn't having a go, but I have seen people being so judgemental towards women whose bodies don't suit their idea of how women "should" look and there's definitely a bias amongst some people against fit, strong looking women.
But at the end of the day it's how we feel inside ourselves that counts, which is why I'm trying to approach things from a more "holistic" place so the inside is feeling as healthy as the outside.

skram said:

I just really dislike carrying much body fat and to get the level of striation and vascularity that I like to have on a daily basis I find that my body stops functioning as well as it should.

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Physical training and diet can change the way you
look
feel
perform

If you max out on one, you compromise the others. Champion weightlifters (perform) hurt their joints (health) and might get pudgy if they move up weight categories (looks), people with perfect health won't have as high lifts or low marathon time as they might otherwise, etc. By going to very low bodyfat (looks), you will sacrifice how you feel (health) and performance (lifts, etc).

There's no way around that, it's physiology, you can't change it anymore than you can change bleeding when you're cut, or getting sick if you eat chicken that's been left to defrost on the windowsill on a warm summer's day.

You can have your health, or you can have very low bodyfat. Not both. Your choice. I encourage you to choose health.

skram said:

This isn't meant to sound harsh, but honestly? I don't really care what someone else wants for my body.

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That's your right, it's your body. I'm simply saying that if you want certain things, there is a price to pay. The price you pay for very low bodyfat is a severe strain on your present and long-term health. I'm a personal trainer, my first priority is always the health and safety of clients, there's no way I could support a goal of being very low bodyfat long-term. Nothing to do with what I find sexy in a woman, I'd say the same to a man. Health comes first, always.

The middle ground in health terms is for a woman bodyfat in the high teens. Around 13-14% most women will start to develop health problems with long-term effects. Above 20% is not unhealthy, but is more bodyfat than is fashionable for the "fitness model" physique many bodybuilding women are after. So the middle ground is 15-19%. Which is hardly grotesquely fat and hideous to any person except those with eating disorders. Again, health first - this includes mental health.

Kyle Aaron said:

. By going to very low bodyfat (looks), you will sacrifice how you feel (health) and performance (lifts, etc).
...
You can have your health, or you can have very low bodyfat. Not both. Your choice. I encourage you to choose health.
...
The middle ground in health terms is for a woman bodyfat in the high teens. Around 13-14% most women will start to develop health problems with long-term effects. Above 20% is not unhealthy, but is more bodyfat than is fashionable for the "fitness model" physique many bodybuilding women are after. So the middle ground is 15-19%. Which is hardly grotesquely fat and hideous to any person except those with eating disorders. Again, health first - this includes mental health.

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Yep, you're right. I mean, don't get me wrong, i was never below 8%, I was probably around 8-12% for a year but I wasn't taking care of myself, therefore I was too tired to train effectively and so I maintained that level through restricting my caloric intake. And I do not want to go down that path again, trust me.
I suppose I thought that maybe if I did it right this time, by eating more but also training more i could get to that 12% level and maintain it without the side effects that I suffered last time... *shrugs*
No harm in asking, eh? Fortunately I'm not stubborn enough these days to insist it can be done, which is why I posted the question, to get an idea of what is sustainable in the long run and what isn't.
Thank you so much for taking the time to respond so thoroughly to my post, I appreciate it
em

Try and get as strong as possible... No problems there

n00bs said:

Try and get as strong as possible... No problems there

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Imma try, old bones notwithstanding

My wife is 46, has been tested at 14%, where she pretty much stays year round.

She's had 5 kids, trains heavy ( 12 National powerlifting records, 4 World records) and has zero health issues.

She has lifted since 1988. Long term health is far more important to her than a few cross striations.

I know BB needs much lower BF levels, its important to to harm to yourself to win a $5 plastic trophy.

You seem like a smart girl, I'm sure you'll come out with the right conclusion.

Do you train at Pete's gym in Mornington? Adrenalin.

Welcome skram,

What does your coach say on the issue?

Amenorrhea is definitely a serious issue in competitive BB and I haven't heard of how one can avoid it in conjunction with getting down to really low body fat %'s... would be interesting to see what info you turn up.

PTC said:

My wife is 46, has been tested at 14%, where she pretty much stays year round.

She's had 5 kids, trains heavy ( 12 National powerlifting records, 4 World records) and has zero health issues.

She has lifted since 1988. Long term health is far more important to her than a few cross striations.

I know BB needs much lower BF levels, its important to to harm to yourself to win a $5 plastic trophy.

You seem like a smart girl, I'm sure you'll come out with the right conclusion.

Do you train at Pete's gym in Mornington? Adrenalin.

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No, I'm just training at a little boxing gym in Rye, and they tend to put a lot more focus on free weights rather than machines which is good.
I've just started back with training, so I'm on a very simple programme of static holds one day and weights the next and decent periods of rest. I need to get my core strength up as I'm pretty weak right now.

You're wife sounds pretty awe inspiring, I really enjoy lifting but being a single mum and 39 years old worries me that maybe I can't get back into the shape I want, it's nice to know that's not necessarily true

I competed once in deadlift and lifted 102.5 @ 50kg which was such an amazing feeling (at the Elsternwick Hotel back in the 90's). You'd probably know some of the same people I did back then, Barry (Baz), Ange Gilato (benchpress champ) and a few others. There was also a lovely man in his 60's(?) who lived down Frankston way and was very involved in the powerlifting circles but I can't remember his name.

Anyway, thanks for the comment,
Em

katie said:

Welcome skram,

What does your coach say on the issue?

Amenorrhea is definitely a serious issue in competitive BB and I haven't heard of how one can avoid it in conjunction with getting down to really low body fat %'s... would be interesting to see what info you turn up.

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I don't have a coach yet as I've just started up again, although I would love to have someone there to guide and encourage me. Unfortunately I can't afford it and I'm kinda ashamed of my lack of strength and physique atm, so the less people involved in my training right now the better haha
I just thought I'd see if there was anything I could do to avoid getting back to that point (aside from the obvious "don't go that lean again" ).


*sighs* Oh well, it's all about compromise, right?

It's your choice I know plenty of female BB'ers and figure competitors but after seeing what they go through, it's not for me. I do admire their dedication though, it's certainly not easy.

All the best with getting back into it - I will be doing the same after I pop this baby out (officially overdue now, so will give birth in the next 2 weeks or so). Maybe you could start a journal on here to log your lifts?

katie said:

It's your choice I know plenty of female BB'ers and figure competitors but after seeing what they go through, it's not for me. I do admire their dedication though, it's certainly not easy.

All the best with getting back into it - I will be doing the same after I pop this baby out (officially overdue now, so will give birth in the next 2 weeks or so). Maybe you could start a journal on here to log your lifts?

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Oh wow, good luck with the baby! Is this your first?
I have a 6 year old daughter- she was a severe IUGR baby, 1400 grams/2lb 4oz at 36 weeks. I never even got to experience labour, I had an emergency caesarian though I had planned to go natural.
LOL, kids, nothing you plan around them goes as you expect, so be prepared to go with the flow
*sending you ~quick & easy labour~ vibes*

Congrats Katie! Good to see you lifting again Skram. I've finally talked my partner into lifting and she now loves it. You should definitely start a training diary because the more female diaries the better. Gives my partner the chance to see how in her reach strength is.
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